[todde702]

"Not give a dealer a chance to find and fix"??? I had it in two separate certified dealers after both episodes. Both times they told me, "sorry, but we can't duplicate the problem, so we won't be able to fix anything if we don't know what we're looking for," and sent me on my way. The guy in Las Cruces actually told me it was probably just some fluke occurrence because New Mexico is know to have some crazy stuff happen. Really?!? That's the response I get from a service manager? That sure is a vote of confidence.

Why didn't a single sensor or warning instrument record that the engine had died on its computer? But because it didn't, both dealerships looked at me like was lying to them about it happening.

And while I was covered under the warranty, all that did was cover my towing expenses. As their trained technician would say, they can't replace anything when they don't know what to look for. What good is a warranty in that case?

Yea, I guess I should have said a good dealer. That kind of treatment from a dealer sucks. As if someone is going to just tow a perfectly running car to them? And I apologize if my initial tone was off. I hate to see people get shafted.

Anyway, there are very few reasons a vehicle would die and not set a code. The fuel pump an/or fuel pressure would be one of them. Bad gas could be a factor, but I'd imagine there would be a rash of vehicles at a dealership local to the serving station. They should have at least checked out the fuel pump pressure and had a look inside the tank for debris that might have caused the issue. Our tanks are a split well tank, with a siphon tank on one side pumping fuel into the drivers side. Both sides have their own floats for the gauge and it averages between them. Maybe the siphon pump jammed causing an out of fuel issue? The gauge would still read between E to 1/2 full. Then towing it causes fuel to slosh around putting enough back over to start things up.

 

[RiotWagon]

Seen this posting on another site. I have read 4 or 5 post of events in which the engine stalls.....

"Here is our experience with our manual 4WD 2009 Patriot: It has gotten mostly Ok gas mileage on the highway. When we first bought it, we were getting about 29-30MPG highway, but after about a year, this was probably down to 25MPG. However, around town, mileage occasionally was as poor as about 15MPG.Keep in mind we have standard transmission, AND we know how to drive a standard to optimize mileage. So, this vehicle is probably not quite what it is implied to be as a fuel cost friendly JEEP model. About 2 years into ownership, we were on a long trip, and in the middle of nowhere, and O2 sensor failed, and it caused the vehicle to fail entirely. I have never had a O2 sensor failure cause a vehicle to essentially stop running, but it did… with our Patriot. We had to get it towed, rent a temporary vehicle, but luckily the sensor was under warranty, and the dealership people were really quite helpful with our emergency. In year three, on another long trip, after about 500 miles, the engine began to stall at high speed (75MPH) after slowing for traffic, and was worse when dropping speed and into lower gear. We made it to a nearby dealership. They recognized the problem, but could not identify the cause. Suggested we had dirty fuel, added injection cleaner, and we were off for another 300 miles before it failed again as I slowed to a stop sign after nearly continuous high speed cruise. From there on, I nursed the vehicle another 1000 miles at low speed and frequent stops to our destination. Took it to another dealership, and they also couldn’t find the cause. Here is what I think. There are some fundamental issues in the Patriot engine, ignition, cruise control, and throttle designs. All problems tended to occur at high elevation, >6000ft. always just after disengaging cruise control, and after suddenly needing to slow the vehicle after a long cruise. There is a chance we were experiencing vapor lock, but don’t think so. I think the cruise control may not be correctly releasing control of the throttle. The dealerships we have visited have not disputed this scenario, but have also suggested (remarkably) that the patriot may be too underpowered for high speed high elevation driving, and has insufficient reserve power when the engine is placed under stress of sudden declines at speed to lower gear where more power is required from the engine for quick accelerations. Normally you lose power at higher gear, but the Patriot seems to lose power at lower year after the engine has been stressed. Here are my final thoughts. I suspect the patriot is too underpowered for anything but normal around the town driving. If you want a vehicle for long distance, high temperature conditions, higher elevation, steep climbs, 4WD use, the Patriot is NOT a good choice. I would stick with a Wrangler or Cherokee. If your Patriot will only remain in town, it may be OK, but be careful out of town."

 

[MrMischief]

My first thought was vapor lock.

 

[ColoradoMan]

2.0

They don't make the 4x4 version in a 2 litter. Idk, what kind of pat you are driving. Sounds like you don't have the manual trans either. Since the engine really can't die if you are in gear.

 

[dtolz43]

They don't make the 4x4 version in a 2 litter. Idk, what kind of pat you are driving. Sounds like you don't have the manual trans either. Since the engine really can't die if you are in gear.

Sorry, I meant to type 2.4L.

And no, my Patriot didn't have a manual transmission.

Yes, the engine just completely died while driving it at an unchanging 70mph pace in the highest gear. No warning lights and all gauges were fully functioning up until the failure.

 

[ColoradoMan]

So the warning lights came on? or did all the gauges fail when the engine died?

 

[dtolz43]

So the warning lights came on? or did all the gauges fail when the engine died?

No warning lights came on prior to the failure, so nothing was telling me there was a problem and I should pull over. It just failed. Once the engine died, yes all the gauges also died as if you turned the car off. The speedo just gradually went down as I coasted to a stop, almost as if I were in neutral and had turned the car off on my own...however I was in drive without any acceleration power whatsoever.

Once I was stopped, the car would not start again, and their were no warning lights in the dash telling why it wouldn't start.

 

[dtolz43]

Anyway, there are very few reasons a vehicle would die and not set a code. The fuel pump an/or fuel pressure would be one of them. Bad gas could be a factor, but I'd imagine there would be a rash of vehicles at a dealership local to the serving station. They should have at least checked out the fuel pump pressure and had a look inside the tank for debris that might have caused the issue. Our tanks are a split well tank, with a siphon tank on one side pumping fuel into the drivers side. Both sides have their own floats for the gauge and it averages between them. Maybe the siphon pump jammed causing an out of fuel issue? The gauge would still read between E to 1/2 full. Then towing it causes fuel to slosh around putting enough back over to start things up.

If it was bad gas, apparently there was an outbreak of gas allergic to highway-bound Patriot's this summer in America.

Recent reports from the NHTSA:

Aug 27, 2012 - Rancho Cucamonga, CA - Engine
ON A SATURDAY, MY WIFE WAS ON THE FREEWAY DRIVING ABOUT 70MPH, AWAY FROM HOME, HEAVY TRAFFIC AND 3 KIDS IN THE PATRIOT. THE JEEP LOST ALL POWER (SAW THE RED LIGHTENING BOLT INDICATOR ON THE DASH), THEN STALLED AND SHE HAD TO IMMEDIATELY TRANSITION TO THE EDGE OF THE FREEWAY, WHICH HAD A VERY NARROW SHOULDER. SHE ATTEMPTED FOR AN HOUR AND A HALF TO START THE JEEP. A STATE TROOPER SHOWED UP ADVISED IT WAS UNSAFE FOR THE KIDS. THE TROOPER TOOK THE KIDS TO THE LOCAL CHRYSLER/JEEP DEALER. THE JEEP WAS TAKEN TO LOCAL DEALER. THE SALES MANAGER, AFTER THE JEEP CAME OFF THE TOW TRUCK WAS ABLE TO START THE JEEP. HE SAID MAYBE SHE ACCIDENTALLY ACTIVATED THE 4WD, THEN PROCEEDED TO TAPE IT DOWN AND TOLD HER IF IT RUNS OK ON SUNDAY SHE SHOULD BE OK TO DRIVE HOME. MY WIFE WAS ABLE TO DRIVE THE PATRIOT SUNDAY AND STARTED HOME ON MONDAY. ABOUT 30 MILES FROM HOME IT HAPPENED AGAIN, THE LIGHTENING BOLT, LOST ALL POWER AND IT STALLED. SHE WAS ON THE FREEWAY AT 70MPH AND HAD TO MERGE TO THE SHOULDER WITH MEDIUM TRAFFIC CONDITIONS. SHE TRIED TO START THE PATRIOT FOR 40 MINUTES, IT DID NOT START. WHILE WAITING FOR THE TOW TRUCK A CHP OFFICER STOPPED, STATED AS THE TROOPER HAD PREVIOUSLY, IT WAS UNSAFE FOR THE KIDS TO BE ON THE FREEWAY. HE TOOK THEM TO THE LOCAL CHRYSLER/JEEP DEALER SO THEY WOULD BE SAFE. BOTTOM LINE "THE JEEP LOST ALL POWER (SAW THE RED LIGHTENING BOLT INDICATOR ON THE DASH), THEN STALLED" TWICE IN 3 DAYS. CHRYSLER/JEEP TO DATE HAS STATED, IF THERE ARE NO CODES THERE IS NOTHING THEY CAN DO. THIS VEHICLE IS UNSAFE TO DRIVE AS INDICATED BY MY WIFE'S EXPERIENCE AND 7 OTHER COMPLAINTS LISTED ON THIS SITE. PLEASE DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS UNSAFE VEHICLE CONDITION BEFORE SOMEBODY GETS KILLED.


Aug 10, 2012 - Ridgefield Park, NJ - Engine
THE CONTACT OWNS A 2012 JEEP PATRIOT. THE CONTACT WAS DRIVING 65 MPH WHEN THE VEHICLE STALLED WITHOUT WARNING. THE VEHICLE WAS TOWED TO THE DEALER WHO REPLACED THE CRANKSHAFT SENSOR. THE FAILURE HOWEVER, RECURRED TWICE AND THE CRANKSHAFT SENSOR WAS REPLACED TWICE. THE FAILURE RECURRED A THIRD TIME AND THE VEHICLE WAS TAKEN BACK AT THE DEALER WHERE THE CONTACT WAS AWAITING REPAIRS. THE MANUFACTURER WAS NOT NOTIFIED OF THE FAILURE. THE FAILURE MILEAGE WAS 7,100. KMJ..UDATED08-30-12 UPDATED 09/07/2012


Jul 18, 2012 - Steamboat Springs, CO - Engine
TRAVELING AT 65 MPH ON STATE HIGHWAY IN WYOMING ABOUT AN HOUR OUT OF CASPER WHEN THE ENGINE SHUT DOWN AND WOULD NOT RESTART. TEMPERATURE WAS IN THE 80S AND SKY WAS PARTLY OVERCAST. THERE WAS NO CELL PHONE COVERAGE, BUT A HIGHWAY PATROL OFFICER STOPPED AND ASSISTED. AFTER ABOUT AN HOUR THE ENGINE DID RESTART AND WE WERE ABLE TO TRAVEL ON WITHOUT FURTHER INCIDENT. THIS IS THE SECOND TIME IN A MONTH THAT THE ENGINE HAS SHUT DOWN WITHOUT ANY ASCERTAINABLE REASON. THIS TIME THE TRAFFIC WAS LIGHT AND WE WERE ABLE TO COAST OFF THE TRAVELED PORTION OF THE HIGHWAY. THE FIRST TIME WAS ON INTERSTATE 25 IN UTAH, THE TRAFFIC WAS VERY HEAVY AND WE WERE LUCKY THAT THERE WAS NOT AN ACCIDENT. THE PRIOR TIME THE CAR WOULD NOT RESTART UNTIL THE NEXT DAY AND WAS TOWED.


Jul 09, 2012 - Belleville, NJ - Engine
TL* THE CONTACT OWNS A 2012 JEEP PATRIOT. THE CONTACT STATED THAT WHILE DRIVING APPROXIMATELY 70 MPH, THE ENGINE STALLED WITH THE ILLUMINATION OF THE ESC WARNING INDICATOR. THE VEHICLE WAS MANEUVERED TO THE SIDE OF THE ROAD AND THE ENGINE WAS TURNED OFF. THE VEHICLE WAS IN THE PROCESS OF BEING TOWED TO AN AUTHORIZED DEALER FOR DIAGNOSIS. THE MANUFACTURER WAS NOTIFIED OF THE PROBLEM. THE APPROXIMATE FAILURE MILEAGE WAS 4,475.


Jul 06, 2012 - Ilion, NY - Engine
TL* THE CONTACT OWNS A 2012 JEEP PATRIOT. THE CONTACT STATED THAT WHILE DRIVING APPROXIMATELY 65 MPH, THE ENGINE STALLED WITHOUT WARNING. THE VEHICLE FAILED TO RESTART AND WAS TOWED TO AN AUTHORIZED DEALER. THE FAILURE WAS NOT DIAGNOSED BECAUSE THE ENGINE STARTED ON THE FIRST ATTEMPT. THE IDENTICAL FAILURE RECURRED. THE CONTACT SCHEDULED AN APPOINTMENT WITH THE DEALER FOR A DIAGNOSTIC TEST TO BE PERFORMED. THE MANUFACTURER WAS NOTIFIED OF THE PROBLEM. THE APPROXIMATE FAILURE MILEAGE WAS 5,300. UPDATED 8/6/12


Jul 03, 2012 - Steamboat Springs, CO - Engine
I-15 OUTSIDE ST. GEORGE, UTAH. OUTSIDE TEMP 110. 4:30 P.M. DRIVING SINCE 11 A.M. DRIVEN 275 MILES ON A FULL TANK OF MID GRADE GAS WITH OVER 1/4 TANK LEFT. ENGINE SHUT DOWN AND WOULD NOT RESTART. TRIED AGAIN SEVERAL TIMES OVER THE NEXT TWO HOURS. ENGINE WOULD CRANK BUT NOT FIRE. TOWED INTO STEPHEN WADE JEEP DEALERSHIP AND LEFT OVERNIGHT. VEHICLE STARTED THE NEXT MORNING. REPAIR SHOP COULD FIND NO PROBLEM. HAVE DRIVEN 600 MORE MILES SINCE THEN WITH NO PROBLEM. THERE WAS NO CRASH BECAUSE WE WERE FORTUNATE TO GET OFF THE ROAD WITHOUT INCIDENT ALTHOUGH TRAFFIC WAS VERY HEAVY.


May 23, 2012 - Redding, CT - Engine
5/21 1ST, 5/22 2ND, LOSS OF COMPLETE POWER WHILE DRIVING ON HIGHWAY. WHILE DRIVING A WEDDING GIFT OF A NEW 2012 JEEP PATRIOT ON THEIR HONEYMOON CROSS COUNTRY TO THEIR NEW HOME IN CA, THE NEW WEDDING GIFT CAR DIED AT 65 MPH ON OHIO HIGHWAY. FIXED IN OHIO (NEWLEYWEDS LEFT FROM RI), THEY PROCEEDED JOURNEY TO CA. IN ILLINOIS, HIGHWAY DRIVE AGAIN SAME SCENARIO, CAR DIED.

 

[todde702]

My first thought was vapor lock.

This isn't a bad idea. Our fuel system has no fuel return line from the engine. The pump regulates the pressure in the tank and dumps excess fuel right back into the tank. Given a hot enough engine bay, the fuel could be vaporizing in the line and vapor doesn't spray out of injectors very well.

As for the post about the Patriot being too under powered for sustained high speed blah blah blah...174 hp is plenty of power. My old 1976 Camaro only had 160 hp. My 1987 Montero 4 cyl. had 109 hp and never had trouble cruising in high elevations and hot temps (Pocono mtns in the summer). Plus there are plenty of people in Arizona/New Mexico and S.Cal that cruise at high temps and elevations.

 

[dtolz43]

A couple more NHTSA reports from this summer, just for good measure:

Aug 01, 2012 - Waynesville, MO - Engine
MY 2011 JEEP PATRIOT (LIMITED, TRAIL RATED) SUDDENLY STALLED WHILE TRAVELING 70-75 MPH ON THE INTERSTATE. THE CAR HAD BEEN TRAVELING ON INTERSTATE/HIGHWAY FOR APPROXIMATELY 3 HOURS PRIOR TO THE INCIDENT, WITH NO STOPS OR PROBLEMS. MY HUSBAND WAS DRIVING IN THE PASSING LANE, NOTICED THAT THE CAR STARTED SLOWING DESPITE PRESSING THE GAS PEDAL. HE MANAGED TO MERGE THROUGH TRAFFIC TO THE SIDE OF THE ROAD. THE ENGINE HAD COMPLETELY DIED BEFORE HE CAME TO A STOP. NO WARNING LIGHTS ILLUMINATED ON THE DASHBOARD. NO SPUTTERING OR SHUDDERING OCCURRED. THERE WAS NO INDICATION THAT THE CAR HAD OVERHEATED. THERE WAS NO INDICATION ANYTHING WAS WRONG UNTIL THE CAR BEGAN TO SLOW. HE DID HAVE CRUISE CONTROL ACTIVE AT THE TIME. THE CAR HAD TO BE TOWED AS IT WOULD NOT RESTART AFTER THE INCIDENT. (HE TRIED TO RESTART SEVERAL TIMES WITHIN THE 30-45 MINUTES IT TOOK FOR THE TOW TRUCK TO ARRIVE, IT WOULD TRY TO START (IT WOULD TURN OVER?) BUT WOULD NOT ACTUALLY START) ADDITIONALLY, I HAVE NOTED TWICE THE CAR TOOK SLIGHTLY LONGER TO START AFTER SITTING IN THE SUN ALL DAY, BUT THIS IS REALLY A NON "ISSUE" SINCE IT HAS ALWAYS STARTED. IT JUST TOOK MAYBE .5 SECONDS LONGER THAN NORMAL ON TWO OCCASIONS. I DO NOT KNOW IF THE START TIME IS RELATED, AT ALL, TO THIS STALLING INCIDENT. THIS CAR IS LESS THAN 1 YEAR OLD, AND HAS ALMOST 18,000 MILES ON IT. THIS EVENT COULD HAVE BEEN EXTREMELY DANGEROUS. THANKFULLY, THERE WAS NO OTHER VEHICLE IMMEDIATELY BEHIND THE CAR WHEN THIS EVENT OCCURRED. THE CAR IS CURRENTLY AT THE DEALERSHIP FOR SERVICE TOMORROW.


Jul 31, 2012 - Medford, OR - Engine
I WAS DRIVING ON NB I-5 IN A 2005 SUBARU. THE VEHICLE IN FRONT OF ME WAS THIS 2011 JEEP PATRIOT THAT I AM COMPLAINING ABOUT. WE WERE DRIVING APPROX. 65MPH. I WAS NOT TAILGATTING! THE JEEP PATRIOT'S POWER DIED. THE DRIVER THOUGHT SHE WAS NOT GETTING GAS AND KEPT HITTING THE GAS PEDAL. SHE NEVER HIT THE BRAKE. I DID NOT SEE A BRAKE LIGHT AND IT TOOK ME A COUPLE SECONDS TO REALIZE SHE HAD SLOWED, THEN STOPPED (THAT IS WHY I PUT SHE WAS GOING APPROX. 30MPH). RESEARCH SHOWS IT TAKES 2-1/2 TIME LONGER TO BRAKE IF YOU DO NOT SEE BRAKE LIGHTS. SHE DID NOT PULL OVER TO THE MEDIAN. NEEDLESS TO SAY, BY THE TIME I SLAMMED ON MY BRAKES, I HIT HER. I WAS STILL GOING ABOUT 55MPH. MY AIRBAGS DEPLOYED. MY 85 YEAR OLD MOTHER WAS IN THE CAR WITH ME AND WAS SERIOUSLY INJURED. I WAS ALSO INJURED BUT WAS ABLE TO RECOVER IN A MATTER OF 6-8 WEEKS. AS I RESEARCH THIS VEHICLE, I FIND THAT NOT ONLY THE 2011 PATRIOT HAS THIS PROBLEM, BUT SO DOES THE 2012 PATRIOT. WHEN IS JEEP GOING TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS PROBLEM. APPARENTLY JEEP MECHANICS KNOW THIS PROBLEM OCCURS BUT DO NOT KNOW WHY. BTW, THIS WAS A RENTAL VEHICLE FOR THE DRIVER OF THE PATRIOT.

 

[dixiedawg]

I agree Todde, looking over those other situations I can see nothing external to cause the issue.

And to me, for a 4cyl, the Patriot has plenty of power.

The Steamboat Springs one is odd too, it doesn't say Patriot, and to have a 1/4 tank of gas left after 275 miles is not something the Patriot can do. At least not mine.

I sure would like to see the resolution for those folks, that sure could help.

 

[dixiedawg]

Another one with Cruise, hmmmm.

Oh and in my state, you rear end someone, it's your fault.

 

[todde702]

If it was bad gas, apparently there was an outbreak of gas allergic to highway-bound Patriot's this summer in America.

No, those are from all over. Bad gas would be mostly localized complaints. All of them are highway travel related though, just like your incident so there clearly has to be a common problem/issue here, but again, not something that is affecting all Patriots.

Hmmm...didn't they redesign the intake manifold in 2011?

From www.allpar.com engines section:

The “World Gas Engine” spawned a new generation, dubbed “Tigershark,” in 2.0 and 2.4 liter versions. Wiped clean of the Daimler errors, the Tiger Shark is more balanced than the horsepower-biased first generation; expected production is 600,000 per year, and it is to completely replace the current World Gas Engine starting in 2012. There are both standard Dual-VVT (2.0) and MultiAir (2.4) versions.

I wonder if these started appearing in 2011? The new intake, according to the pictures on the site, no longer has the flapper valves.

<EDIT>
Plus the new engine has the intake manifold back by the firewall with the exhaust in the front now.

 

[MrJeepR44]

Man it's starting to sound like I'm just lucky. I've driven my Patriot from D.C. to Dallas, Dallas to Shreveport, Dallas to Hot Springs, Dallas to Denver, Denver to Salt Lake, and Salt Lake Back to Dallas, and my Jeep has never died on me. That included driving 70 MPH at 10,000 feet on I-70. Its been flawless driving to Fort Worth and back when it was 110°. I feel bad for those it is apparently happening to, and hope Jeep figures it out so it is easy to diagnose and fix if it is widespread

Sent from my Nexus 7 using AutoGuide App

 

[Wooden Dog]

No, those are from all over. Bad gas would be mostly localized complaints. All of them are highway travel related though, just like your incident so there clearly has to be a common problem/issue here, but again, not something that is affecting all Patriots.

Hmmm...didn't they redesign the intake manifold in 2011?

From www.allpar.com engines section:



I wonder if these started appearing in 2011? The new intake, according to the pictures on the site, no longer has the flapper valves.

<EDIT>
Plus the new engine has the intake manifold back by the firewall with the exhaust in the front now.

Patriot didn't get the Tigerhshark engine. Maybe the 2014 will...?

 

[MrMischief]

Those complaints all sound like vapor lock.

 

[ColoradoMan]

It sounds like an electrical problem to me.

 

[dixiedawg]

Any chance it could be related to cruise control?

 

[Stonent]

I'd be interested what pending codes were in the engine computer. Pending codes don't illuminate the check engine light until they've been active for more than a preset period. For example misfires don't typically flip the light until they get over 12,000 misfires. Which at 2000 RPM would be about 12 minutes of continuous misfirings on a cylinder.

In my experience of cars I've owned sudden stalling has been caused by electrical shorts (O2 sensor wire burned and touching the exhaust manifold) on a 1996 Dodge Stratus. Low oil on my 1999 Dodge Ram 1500, sudden overheat due to a bad water pump 1993 Chevy S-10 4.3l, bad crank sensor 2009 Jeep Patriot, low oil 2002 Mitsubishi Galant.

 

[Tommy27]

Dodge Engine Shutoff

FWIW--I bought a new Dodge Shadow in 1987. A few weeks later, cruising along a Chicago freeway, I honked the horn and the engine shut off. I got to the shoulder, stopped, and it came back on. It seemed like the horn switch, but my dealer replaced various parts, including the computer, without fixing the problem. Finally he replaced the horn switch and the problem went away for good, after a factory representative happened to notice the mechanic working on my car, and mentioned that a car in a nearby town had the same problem.