Ok, so I was asked in a different thread about this, but i figure it deserves its own thread. I have had the unique experience of doing about as hard core off roading in my modified patriot and then doing the same/similar trails in a modified cherokee XJ. I know there are others that can chime in as far as their experiences, as there have been a number who have owned both.
First and foremost. an XJ and a patriot are two completely different beasts... and yet are very very similar. They, at the time they were new, were both marketed as cheap family haulers with a little off road capability, they are both cobbled together from other platforms and parts bins, (I think that is what defines a jeep more than anything) to produce a cheap vehicle in a class of its own. (Seriously is there anything that truly competes with a patriot, other than the compass?).
On road: a patriot is a car. First and foremost. It has full independent suspension, so gives a decent ride, decent fuel economy, is fairly comfortable. An XJ is a beast. It rights rough, (especially when modded), it wanders, its very loud inside (at least mine is) and it gets **** MPGs.
On sand/grated dirt roads/washes: the patriot excels in this area. Lower your tire pressure and the patriot just goes all day. The washboard waves in the road are soaked up by the suspension. The XJ with its solid axles and modified suspension will rattle your brains out.
On washed out roads: the patriot just doesn't have the articulation. I have been thwarted by very simple obstacle of a simple washed out road, having to take them like a creation takes speed humps
The XJ has a ton of flex, my wheels drop almost 18" vs like 5" on the patriot.
On rocky roads/ over all more difficult trails: patriot doesn't hold a candle to the XJ. where the patriot soaks up the bumps on a grated dirt road, you have to drive so slow and carefully on these kids of trails in the patriot, that you have to drive 1/3 if not 1/4 the speed that they can be taken in the XJ.
Off road techniques: The patriot is an odd duck, because its highest point is the middle of the vehicle, you actually drive OVER the rocks. you just let them slide under you, and try to not bounce, as you will bounce down onto said rock. the XJ you drive over the obstacle with your tire, as the lowest section is your diff on each axle, and you don't want the rock to hit that. it took me a number of trips to change my driving style off road.
Modification: this is pretty obvious, the XJ is simply more mod friendly than the patriot. Its more modular and simply allows for more variable configurations. Axles, transfer cases, engine swaps, suspension setups, bumpers, Tire carriers, etc. Everybody has been there and done that. The patriot, everything is a bit of an experiment... its all a bit new, even lift kits like the RRO have not been out there very long and the bugs seem to still need some massaging out. and you really only have one solid company for modifications, vs thousands for the XJ. I am sure that as time goes on the patriot will find more and more people wanting to make those modifications, as they become more numerous, and older.
Trail damage: this was one of the biggest things my wife and i fought about with the patriot... she would just about kill me when I came home with scratches in the paint on the patriot, the XJ I cam home this week from a trail run that put some nice ones into the cherokee's paint, and she started to say something, and I asked her "do you really care?" and she was like "Nope" and dropped it.
Room: its funny, the patriot and cherokee are similar in size, and yet feel very very different inside. The XJ the chair is quite flat on a flat floor, and your legs sit forward, It is actually more pronounced than in my G35, which i consider more of a sports sedan, which tend to have a low sitting position. the Patriot my legs bent more down, and I sad more like sitting in a chair, a lot more upright. Both are big boxes, but because the cherokee doesn't have things like "safety" to worry about, there are no air bags, no crumple zones, tiny roof pillars, no side impact protection. This leaves for a TON more room inside than the patriot. At least it feels a lot bigger.
Fuel economy: No contest the patriot has better fuel economy. My XJ doesn't run as well as it should so gets pretty poor gas milage, I think I average like 11 or 12 mpg (but all I ever do is take it off road, so its lower because of that) the patriot on its worst day of off roading got 16mpg, and at best 23mpg highway. Not shabby.
Power: If you look at the pure numbers the XJ's 4.0l really doesn't make much more power than the patriot's 2.4L engine. my 89 XJ only has 179 HP. but it makes that HP at a MUCH lower rpm. power delivery is all different. it also has a lot more torque 225, vs the patriots ~160ft/lbs. again at much lower RPM's. the patriot you have to rev the nuts off it to get the power numers. the XJ makes them almost at idle speeds, so crawling in low gear with very little throttle is doable.
Summary. There can be a lot more said about it, But if I had all the money in the world, I would buy another patriot to compliment my XJ. I really would. I only sold it simply to get rid of car payments (dang you dave ramsey!). I probably would NOT put in the RRO lift kit. I might do the springs, but probably not. I would Get the largest tires on the smallest wheels I could (probably a true 30x9.5r15) and then cut where I needed to to get them to not rub. The lift, while it does help, I think compromises too much, and I have my cherokee. The patriot would be my scenic drive vehicle, and the XJ would be my more serious trail rig. Trails like i did on friday (see my other post) would be a perfect thing to take the patriot on. It would have been plenty capable, more comfortable, and allowed me to spend more time enjoying where i was. The XJ likes to add a sense of adventure by running hot at low speeds (it was 107 where I was that day) and sucking fuel so fast I can see the needle move.
Here are some comparison shots -
Flex:
![Image]()
You can see here how much the XJ can flex with an after market suspension setup. and with some fine tuning (read: fender cutting) I could get even more out of it! all 4 tiers are planted on the ground.
![Image]()
Its like its not even trying. the tire is only 3-5" lower than at stock ride height. the thing they do do is go UP which is a problem.
![Image]()
I'm not lifted in this picture, but you can see that the patriot doesn't flow with the ground, it gets tossed to the side.
Ground clearance:
![Image]()
You can see on my XJ, that everything is at least 3-4" above the center line of the tire.
![Image]()
That's the day I brought it home. it had a 2" puck up front and an add a leaf in the rear. both front and rear were sagging pretty good, so it was just above stock height. Everything is still above the center line of the tires.
![Image]()
This is my patriot WITH a 2" lift from rro, see how the bottom of the vehicle is in line with the center of the wheel? that alone is a major problem.
![Image]()
This is bigger tires but NO lift, and the centerline of the tires is ABOVE the bottom of the vehicle. This is not a good combo for off roading. it makes it hard to go over obstacles with your tires when you come off the other side and the tire isn't all the way over before you get high centered.
I'll probably thing of more to add, but if you have any questions or anything to add feel free.
First and foremost. an XJ and a patriot are two completely different beasts... and yet are very very similar. They, at the time they were new, were both marketed as cheap family haulers with a little off road capability, they are both cobbled together from other platforms and parts bins, (I think that is what defines a jeep more than anything) to produce a cheap vehicle in a class of its own. (Seriously is there anything that truly competes with a patriot, other than the compass?).
On road: a patriot is a car. First and foremost. It has full independent suspension, so gives a decent ride, decent fuel economy, is fairly comfortable. An XJ is a beast. It rights rough, (especially when modded), it wanders, its very loud inside (at least mine is) and it gets **** MPGs.
On sand/grated dirt roads/washes: the patriot excels in this area. Lower your tire pressure and the patriot just goes all day. The washboard waves in the road are soaked up by the suspension. The XJ with its solid axles and modified suspension will rattle your brains out.
On washed out roads: the patriot just doesn't have the articulation. I have been thwarted by very simple obstacle of a simple washed out road, having to take them like a creation takes speed humps
The XJ has a ton of flex, my wheels drop almost 18" vs like 5" on the patriot. On rocky roads/ over all more difficult trails: patriot doesn't hold a candle to the XJ. where the patriot soaks up the bumps on a grated dirt road, you have to drive so slow and carefully on these kids of trails in the patriot, that you have to drive 1/3 if not 1/4 the speed that they can be taken in the XJ.
Off road techniques: The patriot is an odd duck, because its highest point is the middle of the vehicle, you actually drive OVER the rocks. you just let them slide under you, and try to not bounce, as you will bounce down onto said rock. the XJ you drive over the obstacle with your tire, as the lowest section is your diff on each axle, and you don't want the rock to hit that. it took me a number of trips to change my driving style off road.
Modification: this is pretty obvious, the XJ is simply more mod friendly than the patriot. Its more modular and simply allows for more variable configurations. Axles, transfer cases, engine swaps, suspension setups, bumpers, Tire carriers, etc. Everybody has been there and done that. The patriot, everything is a bit of an experiment... its all a bit new, even lift kits like the RRO have not been out there very long and the bugs seem to still need some massaging out. and you really only have one solid company for modifications, vs thousands for the XJ. I am sure that as time goes on the patriot will find more and more people wanting to make those modifications, as they become more numerous, and older.
Trail damage: this was one of the biggest things my wife and i fought about with the patriot... she would just about kill me when I came home with scratches in the paint on the patriot, the XJ I cam home this week from a trail run that put some nice ones into the cherokee's paint, and she started to say something, and I asked her "do you really care?" and she was like "Nope" and dropped it.
Room: its funny, the patriot and cherokee are similar in size, and yet feel very very different inside. The XJ the chair is quite flat on a flat floor, and your legs sit forward, It is actually more pronounced than in my G35, which i consider more of a sports sedan, which tend to have a low sitting position. the Patriot my legs bent more down, and I sad more like sitting in a chair, a lot more upright. Both are big boxes, but because the cherokee doesn't have things like "safety" to worry about, there are no air bags, no crumple zones, tiny roof pillars, no side impact protection. This leaves for a TON more room inside than the patriot. At least it feels a lot bigger.
Fuel economy: No contest the patriot has better fuel economy. My XJ doesn't run as well as it should so gets pretty poor gas milage, I think I average like 11 or 12 mpg (but all I ever do is take it off road, so its lower because of that) the patriot on its worst day of off roading got 16mpg, and at best 23mpg highway. Not shabby.
Power: If you look at the pure numbers the XJ's 4.0l really doesn't make much more power than the patriot's 2.4L engine. my 89 XJ only has 179 HP. but it makes that HP at a MUCH lower rpm. power delivery is all different. it also has a lot more torque 225, vs the patriots ~160ft/lbs. again at much lower RPM's. the patriot you have to rev the nuts off it to get the power numers. the XJ makes them almost at idle speeds, so crawling in low gear with very little throttle is doable.
Summary. There can be a lot more said about it, But if I had all the money in the world, I would buy another patriot to compliment my XJ. I really would. I only sold it simply to get rid of car payments (dang you dave ramsey!). I probably would NOT put in the RRO lift kit. I might do the springs, but probably not. I would Get the largest tires on the smallest wheels I could (probably a true 30x9.5r15) and then cut where I needed to to get them to not rub. The lift, while it does help, I think compromises too much, and I have my cherokee. The patriot would be my scenic drive vehicle, and the XJ would be my more serious trail rig. Trails like i did on friday (see my other post) would be a perfect thing to take the patriot on. It would have been plenty capable, more comfortable, and allowed me to spend more time enjoying where i was. The XJ likes to add a sense of adventure by running hot at low speeds (it was 107 where I was that day) and sucking fuel so fast I can see the needle move.
Here are some comparison shots -
Flex:
You can see here how much the XJ can flex with an after market suspension setup. and with some fine tuning (read: fender cutting) I could get even more out of it! all 4 tiers are planted on the ground.
Its like its not even trying. the tire is only 3-5" lower than at stock ride height. the thing they do do is go UP which is a problem.
I'm not lifted in this picture, but you can see that the patriot doesn't flow with the ground, it gets tossed to the side.
Ground clearance:
You can see on my XJ, that everything is at least 3-4" above the center line of the tire.
That's the day I brought it home. it had a 2" puck up front and an add a leaf in the rear. both front and rear were sagging pretty good, so it was just above stock height. Everything is still above the center line of the tires.
This is my patriot WITH a 2" lift from rro, see how the bottom of the vehicle is in line with the center of the wheel? that alone is a major problem.
This is bigger tires but NO lift, and the centerline of the tires is ABOVE the bottom of the vehicle. This is not a good combo for off roading. it makes it hard to go over obstacles with your tires when you come off the other side and the tire isn't all the way over before you get high centered.
I'll probably thing of more to add, but if you have any questions or anything to add feel free.
