Pardon my ignorance but help me out w/ this ESP

neonkitten63 · Jul 16, 2008

So I guess there are three settings....Full on, Full off and Partial On...

What reasons or circumstances would one use these settings?

I am learning everyday about cars so I apologize if this seems to be a stupid question but and all help is much appreciated!

Thanks in advance!

jepstr67 · Jul 16, 2008

In short, you may want to turn ESP off if you are stuck, driving slowly in deep snow or slowly in loose sand. The computerized electronic stability programs may work against you in these situations. Slowing the engine or applying brakes when that is not what you need to have happen.

Randoo-N-CJ · Jul 16, 2008

jepstr67 said:
In short, you may want to turn ESP off if you are stuck, driving slowly in deep snow or slowly in loose sand. The computerized electronic stability programs may work against you in these situations. Slowing the engine or applying brakes when that is not what you need to have happen.

jepster, I can't speak for loose sand (and I haven't been stuck yet either), but I can say safely that I just danced along nicely with my ESP left on while driving slowly in snow. As long as you're going along and NOT stuck, heck, there's no need to play with the default settings on the Jeep (IMHO). If and when I ever get stuck, I may try to shut it off at that time, but we played in snow over a foot deep without so much as a hiccup from our Pat this past winter.

Tony1911 · Jul 17, 2008

Yeah, ESP fully on works in snow, as long as you keep moving. But the moment you stop, you will be stuck there unless you hit that ESP OFF-button and put it at least to partially off-mode. The computer is a real dumb-ass when it comes to getting moving again in deep snow.

Fortunately partial off-mode works in all Patriots and merely requires one single push of a button. Not a big deal, as long as you know about that button.

Mud · Jul 17, 2008

I can tell you from experience that ESP is best turned FULL OFF when driving on sand.
It is also best to engage 4x4 mode too

I have no idea what snow even looks like

Tony1911 · Jul 17, 2008

Mud said:
I have no idea what snow even looks like

White.

APT · Jul 17, 2008

Take a look in your owners manual, that thick book in your glovebox. Or, download a .PDF from here. There are descriptions of how the ESP mode (is supposed to) work and whne you might want to use each mode.

In normal, full on mode, the computers will limit engine torque and apply brakes when it sense wheel slip. Most people will never need to use any other mode. Certain types of drivers and certain driving conditions may find partial or full off useful. Honestly, I cannot think of any scenario when full off is necessary. It can be used for more fun on snow/sand, but that does not mean it has to be off. Partial off does not allow engine torque to be reduced which allows for some wheel slip. Useful for those stopped-on-snow/sand situations those above have mentioned.

jepstr67 · Jul 17, 2008

Randoo-N-CJ said:
jepster, I can't speak for loose sand (and I haven't been stuck yet either), but I can say safely that I just danced along nicely with my ESP left on while driving slowly in snow. As long as you're going along and NOT stuck, heck, there's no need to play with the default settings on the Jeep (IMHO). If and when I ever get stuck, I may try to shut it off at that time, but we played in snow over a foot deep without so much as a hiccup from our Pat this past winter.

I got my car in February so I have not seen much snow with it yet. I'm glad to hear it can manage a foot. I'm surprised such a low slung Jeep does that well in snow. Which storm was that the heavy wet one or the dryer fluffier one? You are only 165 miles from me.

neonkitten63 · Jul 17, 2008

Thanks for the info guys....I really appreciate it!

DJ XS · Jul 18, 2008

Mud said:
I can tell you from experience that ESP is best turned FULL OFF when driving on sand.
It is also best to engage 4x4 mode too

I have no idea what snow even looks like

I have to agree with Mud. I have gone through some sand dunes that most others in my local pat club did not dare. I switched to ESP OFF dropped it to 4x4 and rolled out. I guess you can call ESP OFF = Fun Mode.

Mud · Jul 18, 2008

Tony1911 said:
White.

hmmm very interseting

Randoo-N-CJ · Jul 19, 2008

jepstr67 said:
I got my car in February so I have not seen much snow with it yet. I'm glad to hear it can manage a foot. I'm surprised such a low slung Jeep does that well in snow. Which storm was that the heavy wet one or the dryer fluffier one? You are only 165 miles from me.

That was the gooey wet one. Slush City when things started to finally melt.

Yep, you probably got at least that much if not more, didn't you?

jepstr67 · Jul 19, 2008

Randoo-N-CJ said:
That was the gooey wet one. Slush City when things started to finally melt.

Yep, you probably got at least that much if not more, didn't you?

I went to California to tow back a rust free Scrambler body for a restoration next year. The storm hit me in De Moines where I wiped out on the freeway when a semi passed me. Very little damage, but very frightening.

Then, My wife called and said some "good Samaritan", who never fessed up, had tried to plow our driveway in my absence. It took me 3 hours with our skid loader to dig my way out of the 4' tall frozen pile he created. :doh:

If the Patriot made it through that mess, it is one impressive drive system we have.:banana:

homac · Jul 19, 2008

I agree with those who suggested ESP "Full Off" in deep snow and sand. I tried "Partial Off" and experienced issues, full off made a noticable difference.

I found "Full Off" also works for steep inclines.

RichJet5353 · Jul 22, 2008

Ok...another ESP question...somewhat related. With a 5 speed manual (like mine) how can the engine fluctuate power without shifting by itself? Or is the power fluctuation so minor that a shift wouldn't be necessary? Just curious. Thanks

APT · Jul 22, 2008

All Patriots have electronic throttle control. So, if there is a need to reduce engine power, the throttle plate is not open as much as the driver is requesting. It has nothing to do with shifting in manual trans vehicles. I assure you, it is not minor as it can drop to idle in certain conditions.

jepstr67 · Jul 22, 2008

APT said:
All Patriots have electronic throttle control. So, if there is a need to reduce engine power, the throttle plate is not open as much as the driver is requesting. It has nothing to do with shifting in manual trans vehicles. I assure you, it is not minor as it can drop to idle in certain conditions.

Why would anyone design a vehicle like that? If that happens to me I'll be right back in my cabureted CJ. I hate all this "because we can" electronic crap.

patriotpierre · Jul 22, 2008

APT said:
All Patriots have electronic throttle control. So, if there is a need to reduce engine power, the throttle plate is not open as much as the driver is requesting. It has nothing to do with shifting in manual trans vehicles. I assure you, it is not minor as it can drop to idle in certain conditions.

Really don't want this to happen in the steep hills around here in a snow storm. Had to come to a stop behind a snow plow going up the hills once, lost momentum, started slidding to the side, lost adherance, had to do a 180 degree going reverse and braking, right there, in a curve, go down the hill and climb again. Not a pleasant and secure experience.

APT · Jul 22, 2008

patriotpierre said:
Really don't want this to happen in the steep hills around here in a snow storm. Had to come to a stop behind a snow plow going up the hills once, lost momentum, started slidding to the side, lost adherance, had to do a 180 degree going reverse and braking, right there, in a curve, go down the hill and climb again. Not a pleasant and secure experience.

Why didn't you just push the ESP button for partial mode? That is what it is for, to not allow less torque than driver requested, only apply brakes whne there is a difference between wheel speeds on the same axle.

Almost all vehicles today use electronic throttle control with traction control systems cutting power as it deems necessary. Most drivers, most driving conditions, no one cares or notices. Most drivers, even on snow/ice will get better acceleration once they lose grip by limiting engine torque as requested by the ESP module. Why do our Jeeps think expansion joints/speed bumps are snow? Poor calibration.

wburmil · Jul 23, 2008

ESP HELP

ok guys I have a 08 PAT 2 x 4 2.0 Lt. please tell me about the ESP button and what I can expect it to do and display I do not have the info computer on the left side of the dash just it is a automatic trans with auto stick.

Pardon my ignorance but help me out w/ this ESP

neonkitten63

jepstr67

Randoo-N-CJ

Tony1911

Mud

Tony1911

APT

jepstr67

neonkitten63

DJ XS

Mud

Randoo-N-CJ

jepstr67

homac

RichJet5353

APT

jepstr67

patriotpierre

APT

wburmil

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