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Yes, I am neurotic-----Liberty or Patriot?

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#21 ·
srothfuss said:
The liberty yes but the patriot and Compass? I don't think so
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The Patriot is definatly trying to replace the Cherokee. Probably not the Compass. The Jeep brass is saying that themselves. The videos of Jeep brass on google video show Jeep executives decribing the Patriot as the "spirtual sucessor" of the Cherokee and that description made its way into many of the reviews. Plus I dont think, based on Jeep executives talk, that its coinecidence that the demensions of the two are so close.


PatriotFan said:
Or more basic:
on road = patriot
off road = liberty.
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Expeditions West spent an entire month testing the Patriot off road and believes the Liberty to have only a "slight" advantage off road.

expeditionswest said:
-- The liberty has a V6 and true low-range, but no better maneuverability or dimensions. Liberty has good aftermarket support. The Liberty has a slight trail advantage, but much less economy and road performance.
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Discussion starter · #22 ·
Originally Posted by expeditionswest

The Liberty has a slight trail advantage, but much less economy and road performance.
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The thing they forgot to point out though is that the economy of the Patriot when trail-rated goes way down. Only a couple reviews mentioned this: 21/23 city,hwy
So if trail-rated the Patriot has only slightly better gas mileage than the Liberty.
 
#23 · (Edited)
yea, but as discussed earlier in this post, I think fuel economy will be a bigger differance than the numbers suggest. And Expeditions West was testing a trail rated Patriot and they have alot of exerience testing and reviewing vehicles and are certainly familiar with the Liberty so I doubt that they overlooked that.

EDIT: Expeditions West- If you read this, could you let us know what kind of actual fuel economy you experienced?
 
#24 ·
fuel economy shouldn't even be considered until after 7-10k miles. I am getting ~24mpg for both city and highway. However, I refuse to even look at it now, instead I have the info area set for the outside temperature.

Mike
 
#28 ·
I stand by it - Off Road = Liberty - A used Liberty will out perform a patriot per $ spent any day of the week and twice on sunday. Rubicon Trail anyone?

I'm not saying the patriot isn't off road worthy - it sure is and BY FAR the best in its class in my opinion. But the price mac is quoting its a better off roader for the $.
 
#29 ·
At 10000 miles per year you will use another 150 or so gallons of gas per year or $300 to $400 per 10k. That is comparing a Liberty getting 18 mpg and a Patriot getting around 24 mpg. Those should be good real world numbers. If you do over 24000 miles per year and it is mostly highway you'll be running close to a $2000 difference per year.

None of us here can tell you what is best for you. We can only provide our "free" advice.
 
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#30 · (Edited)
There's some incorrect information floating around here.

Under normal driving conditions, the jeep patriot only uses two wheels, regardless of it being a 4x4 or not. When an increase in speed, quick turns, wheel slippage, etc. are picked up by the sensors, the vehicle shifts into 4 wheel mode for better handling.

This translates into very similar gas mileage to the 4x2. Jeep rates the 4x4 as 1mpg less than the 4x2.

To say everyone will be getting 17-20 miles per gallon with the 4x4 jeep patriot, instead of close to 25-30 mpg is false.

I'd say just go with the freedom drive 1 package if you want off road.
 
#31 ·
OK guys / gals I feel a little bad about being so agumentative yesterday... I just get all 'peeved' when people start bashing the Liberty, when it has been nothing but a great Jeep for me.

About the Patroit vs. Jeep off-road - I think they'll be very close because the Patriot weighs a little bit less and might acutally have some more clearance between the belly and ground.

About the Lib being surpassed by the Patriot... The next gen Liberty is actually going to get a little bigger (i.e. Jeep can charge more!) so the Patriot might, in hindsight, actually be filling the Cherokee / Liberty spot

I've got to wait another week before my dealer gets a Blue patriot in and then I'll probably go down and sign some papers.
 
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Discussion starter · #32 ·
How does the crawl ratio of the Patriot compare to the Low 4WD of the Liberty? 16:1 is the crawl ratio of the Patriot. What the heck does that mean? I think the Liberty is something like 30:1. The Wrangler is a lot more than that. I see the numbers, but they mean nothing to me. Can anyone explain? Is the Patriot wimpy as far as the crawl ratio is concerned?
 
#33 ·
DaveMCD said:
There's some incorrect information floating around here.

Under normal driving conditions, the jeep patriot only uses two wheels, regardless of it being a 4x4 or not. When an increase in speed, quick turns, wheel slippage, etc. are picked up by the sensors, the vehicle shifts into 4 wheel mode for better handling.

This translates into very similar gas mileage to the 4x2. Jeep rates the 4x4 as 1mpg less than the 4x2.

To say everyone will be getting 17-20 miles per gallon with the 4x4 jeep patriot, instead of close to 25-30 mpg is false.

I'd say just go with the freedom drive 1 package if you want off road.
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First, while it is true that the 4x4 does use only the front wheels when traction isnt an issue, there are other factors that reduce gas mileage from the 4x2, such as the added wieght of the 4x4 system. The EPA rating of the trail rated patriot is 21-23. Thats why people are talking about the lower fuel mileage. I dont know why the mileage drops so much for the trail rated. Its got extra weight from the tow hooks and skid plates and I guess the exta inch of clearance might effect the drag coefficient. So to say that trail rated jeep will get 25-30 would be false. It might get better than 21-23 but 30 is a big stretch.

Second, why would you say to go w/ FDI for off road when all of the off road systems are only on the FDII along w/ skid plates, tow hooks, an extra inch of clearance, water sealing, and off road cooling. To say that the FDI is an off road vehicle is to say the Compass is off road capable, since the FDI Patriot and FDI Compass are the same mechanically.
 
#34 ·
MacAttack said:
How does the crawl ratio of the Patriot compare to the Low 4WD of the Liberty? 16:1 is the crawl ratio of the Patriot. What the heck does that mean? I think the Liberty is something like 30:1. The Wrangler is a lot more than that. I see the numbers, but they mean nothing to me. Can anyone explain? Is the Patriot wimpy as far as the crawl ratio is concerned?
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The FDI Patriot has a low gear ratio of 14:1 and the FDII has 19:1. Im not sure what the Liberty is but one of the Patriot reviews said that the Wrangler has a 30:1 crawl ratio.

It changes your gear ratio giving you more torque. Its like in a manual transmission first gear is a higher torque gear to get you moving than second, third and so on. If you try to take off from second gear its a little harder because its giving you less torque. The purpose of 4 lo is a low gear to help you overcome off road obsiticles like steep hills, mud, or climbing over things. But you wont be able to drive as fast, like in the first gear of a manual.
 
#35 · (Edited)
If you want a 4x4, I should say, then go with the Freedom Drive 1. That came out wrong - I didn't mean to say off-road.
You can have great gas mileage and 4x4 handling with Freedom Drive 1.

For every day driving, which I'm sure 95% of buyers out there will be doing, the FD1 setup should be just fine for everyone's 4x4 needs, in tough weather conditions.

Though, I'll be getting the Freedom Drive 2 myself.
 
Discussion starter · #36 ·
Well I finally made a decision !!!
Picked up a Liberty Sport 4x4 Manual last night for $18,500 total.

I narrowed my choice down to the Liberty and a Patriot w/ FD1. I liked both of them, but for different reasons, so I would have been happy with either.

The deciding factor was that they had a Liberty on the lot with the exact options I wanted, and I felt like I got a pretty good deal. Got a price including all fees below invoice and also got a $3000 rebate.

The trail-rated Patriot was not included in my final choice because I felt the gas tank was too small with the reduced mpg of the trail-rating. Would have been filling it up quite a bit.

If anyone wants to buy me a Patriot let me know. I still want one. I understand now why rich people have multiple vehicles.
 
Discussion starter · #39 ·
dunes_ny said:
Congrats on your new Liberty, I think you made a good choice and got a good deal. Mind if I ask what the sticker price was?
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I have no idea what price they had on it at the dealership. Edmunds says the invoice price is $22,279. MSRP $23,760.
With rebate invoice $19,279, msrp $20,760

I had an employee control # because a friend of mine works for Daimler Chrysler, and they are allowed to give out one number per year to a friend.
 
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srothfuss
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