Yes, I am neurotic-----Liberty or Patriot?

MacAttack · Feb 16, 2007

I am going insane. I promise I'll never ask again. Here are my choices and the final prices I could probably get close to:
Trail-Rated Patriot: $18,000 (employee price)
Sport 4WD
No Additional Options
Trail-Rated Liberty: $18,000 (great deal, employee price $3000 rebate)
Sport 4WD
No Additional Options

I test drove both. The Liberty seems a step above in quality...more powerful....feels very solid.....beautiful interior, rear-wheel drive.

Patriot.....feels lighter, more zippy, simple interior(not bad, just not as nice as Liberty), All Wheel Drive w/ low ratio

It's the AWD, Rear Wheel Drive thing that's getting me. AWD good, rear wheel drive no good. Liberty big engine, Patriot small engine. Liberty $3,000 rebate, Patriot no rebate (right now), Liberty 6th year, Patriot 1st year. Help !!!!!!!!!!

Ignoring everything except performance is the Patriot (also known as the Compass in a different shape) inferior to the Liberty? Does a smaller, zippier engine make it worse? Does the CVT transmission make it worse?

Sorry to bring this up again, but it's my life savings. I've only bought 1 vehicle in my life and had it for 14 years, and I don't make a whole lot of money...............yet.

superdave · Feb 16, 2007

Its really depends on what you like. If you read expedition west's review and his posts here, the Liberty has only a slight edge in off roading and in fact the Patriot is more menuverable off road. The patriot is going to be more efficient, so it'll cost you less in gas. The Liberty is a little faster and can tow alot more. Patriot drives better on road. The CVT isn't for everyone. Patriot drives more like a car, Liberty more like a truck. I didnt think the Patriot engine was underpowered but its noticably less powerful than the Liberty.

I considered the Liberty breifly. I need something that can do some off roading because two of my best friends own ranches that I spend alot of time at and I need to get around there. But I have to drive this vehicle to work everyday and I need to be able to afford to drive it to the ranches. So in the end, after seeing the videos and after reading the reviews, particularly the expeditions west review, I believe that the Patriot is capable enough for all but the most hardcore off roaders, I can afford to drive it to work everyday and on roadtrips, and I feel I can get more for my money with the Patriot. I want a Limited Patriot w/ the BA system, UConnect, tow package, sun roof, and a comprable Liberty would cost me more even with the $3000 rebate and it would cost me more to own. I wasnt crazy about the CVT but it was very nice in stop and go traffic so I dont mind it.

So based on your comments above it sounds like the choice comes down to whether you care more about the gas mileage or the power. If you really enjoy a powerful engine the Patriot might not do it for you. If you want lower fuel bills and a more car like drive the Patriot might be the better choice.

Personally, Im not concerned with the fact that the Patriot is new. I expect the world engine to be reliable scince it was developed with Mitsubishi and Hyundai who both plan to use it. And I expect the CVT to be more reliable and less expensive to repair than a traditional transmission. There's obviously no data to back that up but its based on what I know about mechanics and my conversations about it with my buddy who is a mechanic. And the Liberty dosnt have a stellar reliability record.

Its ok, im neurotic about my car purchases as well, thats why Ive been looking and researching SUV's since November for a purchase this spring or summer.

deltaboy · Feb 16, 2007

$18,000! wow, thats like $6000 under invoice. let us know if you land that deal, so itll give us some firepower to haggle with.

MacAttack · Feb 16, 2007

deltaboy said:
$18,000! wow, thats like $6000 under invoice. let us know if you land that deal, so itll give us some firepower to haggle with.

Invoice on Liberty: $22,279
Invoice on Patriot: $19,108

To SuperDave: The mileage is almost the same if both are trail-rated. Liberty 18/22 city, hwy
Patriot 21/23 city,hwy

Would the Patriot go uphill ok with smaller engine?
I have a weak little truck right now, and it has a lot of trouble getting up a hill on the highway. It will only get to like 65 and that's it, so I am unable to pass anyone. Even if I floor it to pass it just won't do anything.

deltaboy · Feb 16, 2007

my mistake, i didnt read 'no options' and i was going off my fully loaded dream machine. hehehe... although, id like to know about hills. we have lots here in Vancouver. i know my GTi roars up them like a little devil.

superdave · Feb 16, 2007

MacAttack said:
To SuperDave: The mileage is almost the same if both are trail-rated. Liberty 18/22 city, hwy
Patriot 21/23 city,hwy

.

If you go with the automatic which most Liberty's are, its 17/22. And that would be more of a true comparison to the Patriots automatic.

If you average those out the the Patriot would average what the Liberty would get at best. I dont know how they figured that. Does that consider off road driving in low gear? It seems hard for me to believe that the extra wieght of the skid plates reduces gas mileage by 3mpg. Mabye it does. And since the skid plates are an option on the Liberty, does its mileage figure take extra weight into account? I still think there will be noticeable differance in mileage especially in city driving where the efficiency of the cvt far exceeds the Liberty's 4 speed.

srothfuss said:
Right now I have a Jeep Liberty it gets about 18 - 20 MPG on the highway and around 16 MPG in the city.

Regardless, its not a huge differance but its signifigant to me because Im not as concerned with the gas prices today as I am with gas prices 5 years from now when I intend to still be driving my next vehicle.

silvermike · Feb 16, 2007

If you are the type that must have the latest and greatest buy the Patriot. If you are someone who wants a fantastic deal go with the Liberty. There is in truth between a 4 and 5 mpg difference between the two as equipped. How many miles you drive per year will determine whether this difference is real or not.

I rented a Liberty Limited last year for several weeks and was very impressed. No off-roading but a comfortable everyday car. The rear tailgate and luggage area, and general interior layout is not as well designed as the Compass or Patriot.

srothfuss · Feb 16, 2007

To continue what superdave was talking about... The mileage in the KJ is not the best. Also consider the gas tank size:

roughly
Liberty - 18 gallons
Patroit - 13 gallons

I've been driving the Liberty for 4 years and get around 225 miles per tank of gas before I need to fill up (90% city driving) where as my Sisters Compass (4x2 CVT) can go 250 - 275 miles on the same commute and her car isn't even broken in yet! Then factor in the cost to fill up the gas tank weekly and the Patriot / Compass clearly has the advantage.

Sure the Liberty is going to feel a bit more solid, it weighs in over 4,000 lbs so looking at just a few numbers doesn't really give you the whole picture. I love my liberty though, it'll tow anything and take me anywhere I ask it but I believe the the Patriot would also be able to tow my sailboat and take me camping when I feel the urge.

King · Feb 16, 2007

The Liberty you are talking about must be an older model, like a 2003 or 2004.

Eventhough the Liberty has a V6 and is more powerful than the Patriot, it's still kinda marketed towards female drivers. I notice that mostly women drive the Liberty and Compass, while the men drive the Grand Cherokees, Commanders, and Wranglers.

I'd go with the Patriot. When comparing a new Patriot with a new Liberty, the Patriot is less expensive. Plus the Patriot is easier on gas.

srothfuss · Feb 16, 2007

King said:
The Liberty you are talking about must be an older model, like a 2003 or 2004.

Why does it have to be an older model? From 2002 thru today - they all get the same MPG

King said:
Eventhough the Liberty has a V6 and is more powerful than the Patriot, it's still kinda marketed towards female drivers.

I hope you don't mean the the Liberty is a girly Jeep just because of it's shape? Come on, the Liberty can tow 5,000 pounds, has a 1,000 pound payload capacity and go almost anywhere - those are all things a girl would look for in a Jeep right? On top of this it is more comfortable than the Cherokee it replaced.

King said:
I notice that mostly women drive the Liberty and Compass, while the men drive the Grand Cherokees, Commanders, and Wranglers.

People buy a vehicle that suits their needs:

The Liberty is the best selling Small SUV on the market. Even outselling Toyota and Honda. All of those buyers can't be female.... I know I'm not.

P.S. the Commander is being cancelled after 2008

King said:
I'd go with the Patriot. When comparing a new Patriot with a new Liberty, the Patriot is less expensive. Plus the Patriot is easier on gas.

This we agree on

King · Feb 16, 2007

I was confused about the pricing, thats all. From looking at the Jeep website I noticed that Liberty's start at $22,615, while the Patriot starts at $14,985. So, in general, when comparing a new Liberty with a new Patriot, obviously the Liberty will cost more.

In no was is the Liberty a girly Jeep. I was just saying, compared to other Mid-Size SUVs like the Grand Cherokee or Ford Escape (which mostly men drive), there are a lot of females who drive Liberty's.

In my opinion, The Compass is a girly car, the Dodge Caliber is a girly car, and so is the CR-V and Rav 4. Compared to those I just mentioned the Liberty is obviously the best.

The people at Jeep/DC have realized that the Liberty is somewhat feminine when compared to the Wrangler or Commander, which is why the 2008 Liberty has been re-designed and will look like a Dodge Nitro.

Also, I had no idea that the Commanders will be discontinued. That sucks cause I loved the look of the Commander, but I guess it didn't sell as well as they hoped.

I just hope Jeep come to their senses and discontinue the Compass next year.

tommcg · Feb 16, 2007

hmmm ... rumors are that dcx will get its hands on the latest tahoe platform, which would pave the way for a supersized commander replacement (a 3rd row that people could fit in) ... i like that the new liberty borrows from the commander's styling ... if only they would slap a miniature grand-cherokee front end on the compass, it would be a real "cute" ute ... as is, though, it's miserable looking. sorry, random thoughts i know.

anyway, as for patriot vs liberty, i could never buy a current gen libby knowing that they're finally getting rid of them for a jeep looking design. i know it was the best selling compact suv for 2005, but still, can't we all just act like the whole current liberty thing never happened ...

it's funny to me that almost every current jeep model is in some way trying to replace the cherokee ... the grand cherokee, of course, was to be its original replacement, but folks wanted them to keep the cherokee around too ... then they finally axed it & gave us the liberty, also a cherokee replacement ... years later we get the commander and patriot, different sized carbon copies of eachother based on the cherokee design, trying to win back former cherokee owners ... plus the new liberty goes back to a more cherokee-like design ... so basically jeep offers the legendary wrangler, the compass (which shouldn't exist), and several attempts at replacing the cherokee (grand, commander, patriot, liberty).

superdave · Feb 16, 2007

Im not interested in a Compass but I think it has a place as an alternative to the Rav4, CR-V, and Ecape which are all on road suv's. And if jeep can make more money by getting a share of that market they will be able to offer us better products. And I apploud Jeep for realizing there is a market for an SUV that is both off road capable and reasonably fuel efficient. I too like the Liberty, I would just like a little better gas mileage.

dunes_ny · Feb 16, 2007

If you really want the Liberty over the Patriot...I would suggest looking at a used vehicle before buing new. There are Liberties for sale at virtually every dealer you visit...mostly from expired leases. I've seen them priced around $13k with 20,000 miles, and it never hurts to make a low offer to see where the dealer is willing to land.

xjtke611 · Feb 17, 2007

tommcg said:
...anyway, as for patriot vs liberty, i could never buy a current gen libby knowing that they're finally getting rid of them for a jeep looking design. i know it was the best selling compact suv for 2005, but still, can't we all just act like the whole current liberty thing never happened ...

it's funny to me that almost every current jeep model is in some way trying to replace the cherokee ... the grand cherokee, of course, was to be its original replacement, but folks wanted them to keep the cherokee around too ... then they finally axed it & gave us the liberty, also a cherokee replacement ... years later we get the commander and patriot, different sized carbon copies of eachother based on the cherokee design, trying to win back former cherokee owners ... plus the new liberty goes back to a more cherokee-like design ... so basically jeep offers the legendary wrangler, the compass (which shouldn't exist), and several attempts at replacing the cherokee (grand, commander, patriot, liberty).

Never thought about it that way.... You have a very good point!

srothfuss · Feb 17, 2007

tommcg said:
hmmm ... rumors are that dcx will get its hands on the latest tahoe platform, which would pave the way for a supersized commander replacement (a 3rd row that people could fit in) ... i like that the new liberty borrows from the commander's styling ... if only they would slap a miniature grand-cherokee front end on the compass, it would be a real "cute" ute ... as is, though, it's miserable looking. sorry, random thoughts i know.

Very random indeed:

I wouldn't believe any rumors about GM buying Chrysler... That is just dumb. Sure they can set up a partnership, but a merger would never happen.

The Commander was a HUGE flop, stealing customers from the grandcherokee and offering the gas mileage of a Tahoe / Suburban

I'm sorry you don't like the looks of the Compass, I think its a great vehicle but you know what they say about opinions

tommcg said:
i could never buy a current gen libby knowing that they're finally getting rid of them for a jeep looking design. i know it was the best selling compact suv for 2005, but still, can't we all just act like the whole current liberty thing never happened ...

I guess everything should look like a soap box then? Just roll up to the dealer and select the size that fits your needs...? Sounds really boreing to me

tommcg said:
it's funny to me that almost every current jeep model is in some way trying to replace the cherokee ...

The liberty yes but the patriot and Compass? I don't think so

tommcg said:
the grand cherokee, of course, was to be its original replacement, but folks wanted them to keep the cherokee around too ... then they finally axed it & gave us the liberty, also a cherokee replacement ... years later we get the commander and patriot, different sized carbon copies of eachother based on the cherokee design, trying to win back former cherokee owners ... plus the new liberty goes back to a more cherokee-like design ... so basically jeep offers the legendary wrangler, the compass (which shouldn't exist), and several attempts at replacing the cherokee (grand, commander, patriot, liberty).

The only reason that there is / was the GC & Commander + the Compass & Patriot was an experiment by DCX and Jeep to expand the existing line up into two catagories: Urban and Rugged.

The liberty could have been a little better in some areas, but overall it is a better Jeep for the general public than the Cherokee ever was.

srothfuss · Feb 17, 2007

superdave said:
I would just like a little better gas mileage.

You can say that again!

tommcg · Feb 17, 2007

> I wouldn't believe any rumors about GM buying Chrysler...
me neither.

> you know what they say about opinions
i actually don't believe in "opinion" ... but that's for another forum.

> The liberty . . . is a better Jeep for the general public than the Cherokee ever was.
clearly, since it became the best selling compact suv. moreover, the wrangler is the worst jeep for the general public. certainly no one would suggest that it be discontinued.

emotional appeals aside, i think my earlier comment makes a clear case that most of jeep's lineup descends from the cherokee, including the liberty and patriot this thread discusses. i doubt if we'll ever see a jeep dealership full of attempts at replacing the current gen liberty. in this regard, the cherokee could be considered a much larger success.

PatriotFan · Feb 17, 2007

I get a kick out of people who like the patriot and rip on the compass. Yeah ok they look different - not all people like the same styles. But Selling more Jeeps helps the Jeep brand. If the compass was badged a dodge or chrsyler then there would be less jeeps...less jeeps...less sales...less sales you get morons reporting into CFOs and CEOs saying hey Jeep isnt profitable maybe its time to get out of the niche market...boom poof...no jeeps. Let it be a jeep. If it means the continuation of the brand frig make an 4x4 car like subaru...wait is that a compass?

Rant aside...

Buy the liberty for the proven technology and better interior and towing ability.
Buy the Patriot for looks / warranty and mileage.

Or more basic:
on road = patriot
off road = liberty.

The best thing about the liberty that the patriot cant match as a new vechicle is the liberty is depreciated and should save some $ for a downpayment on a next generation liberty which may get a diesel. If you need to buy now this makes a lot of sence to do.

DaveMCD · Feb 17, 2007

Personally, I think the liberty has a great looking front-end. The back-end however, is ugly. It sits up too high and it's stubby. I always thought they looked like crap because of that.

I'm passing on the liberty just because of that fact. The awful gas mileage for a vehicle of that size really goes against the liberty as well.

PatriotFan said:
Or more basic:
on road = patriot
off road = liberty.

The patriot can keep up just fine with the Liberty with the freedom drive 2 package. The patriot is seriously tricked out; I think it'll pretty much replace the liberty altogether in terms of sales.

Not to mention I think Jeep finally "got it right" with the looks of the Patriot. I'm really keen on the styling of it.

As far as the comments regarding the cheap interior on the Patriot... get the limited edition then. It has leather bucket seats and all sorts of gadgetry like heated seating.

Yes, I am neurotic-----Liberty or Patriot?

MacAttack

superdave

deltaboy

MacAttack

deltaboy

superdave

silvermike

srothfuss

King

srothfuss

King

tommcg

superdave

dunes_ny

xjtke611

srothfuss

srothfuss

tommcg

PatriotFan

DaveMCD

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