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How to increase roof capacity?

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Garrett

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
Hey guys!

I'm looking to do a multi-month travel and seriously considering a hardshell roof top tent. I've seen it done in the past but what would need to be done to make the roof rack capable of 500+ pounds? Do I need different crossbars (Yakima?) or a platform or what? I'm struggling to figure this one out...
 
#2 ·
Only bad things can come of this. Limit the weight on your roof so you don't adversely affect maneuverability, Add a hitch mounted cargo box if needed. You have a lot of good options to choose from.
 
#3 ·
x2, I would not do anything to be able to put that much weight on the roof. Statically you can easily put that much weight up there, but once you start moving, that weight becomes significantly more, and you're just asking to roll over.

Get something like this:
http://amzn.to/2by8ds3

Much safer!
 
#4 · (Edited)
X3. Garrett, If there was a class Off Roading 101, a vehicles changing "center of gravity" would be one of the first topics discussed! Take a couple of minutes and read up on what the "center of gravity" is and how it relates to a vehicles stability.
 
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Discussion starter · #5 · (Edited)
Guys,

Thanks for all the responses. I understand center of gravity, lower and raising it, etc. Would the Tepui hardshell tent drastically increase drag/rollover issues? I'm not doing a plethora of offroading on this trip. Mild trails (at most), dirt/sand roads, and highways will be most of the driving.

Hitch will be used by my bike rack, as of now that can't change due to sponsorship stuff. That may or may not be able to change.

Also to clarify the tent weighs 150lbs. I only need that much weight when we'll be sleeping in it!
 
#6 ·
I don't know what the capacity for the roof is, I know that RangerDave has popped a tent on his roof.

My biggest concern would be the total weight of the tent and yourself on the roof and the rack/crossbars ability to hold that weight.
 
#7 · (Edited)
Seems that you just need to win the lottery to pull this off! Yikes. $2,500 +/- for the James Baroud brand pictured below. The Tepui ($1,000+) web site does differentiate between static and dynamic weight. FYI for everyone, these tents weigh in the neighborhood of +/- 100 lbs and the Tepui site says that their 3 person model can handle 600 lbs.
Image


Instead of trying to modify the vehicle, it might be better to design a system that supports the platform at 4 corners and only uses the vehicle for lateral stability. It would require some engineered aluminum cross bars to handle 600 lbs (tent plus occupants). Even then, the Patriot roof rack system is not very strong. This would be an interesting project for a tinkering engineer. I imagine that your funding is not bottomless. (babe is not included below)
Image


Good luck.

More Patriot pics here: First Impressions: James Baroud Horizon Vision Roof Top Tent | Expedition Portal
https://adventure-ready.com/north-cascades-highway/
 
Discussion starter · #9 ·
Treegrower said:
Seems that you just need to win the lottery to pull this off! Yikes. $2,500 +/- for the James Baroud brand pictured below. The Tepui ($1,000+) web site does differentiate between static and dynamic weight. FYI for everyone, these tents weigh in the neighborhood of +/- 100 lbs and the Tepui site says that their 3 person model can handle 600 lbs.

Instead of trying to modify the vehicle, it might be better to design a system that supports the platform at 4 corners and only uses the vehicle for lateral stability. It would require some engineered aluminum cross bars to handle 600 lbs (tent plus occupants). Even then, the Patriot roof rack system is not very strong. This would be an interesting project for a tinkering engineer. I imagine that your funding is not bottomless.

Good luck.
Click to expand...
I like that idea. Funding is definitely not bottomless. A lot of this is funding through sponsors, fortunately. I like the idea of the multiple aluminum cross bars. My dad is an engineer (who hates cars) so maybe I can snag him into this :grin2:

Do you guys think something like this would help distribute the weight? I don't know how I would engineer this but I'm sure I could get some mocking up done with PVC and move forward
 
#11 · (Edited)
Clarity!

Garrett said:
Guys,

Thanks for all the responses. I understand center of gravity, lower and raising it, etc. Would the Tepui hardshell tent drastically increase drag/rollover issues? I'm not doing a plethora of offroading on this trip. Mild trails (at most), dirt/sand roads, and highways will be most of the driving.

Hitch will be used by my bike rack, as of now that can't change due to sponsorship stuff. That may or may not be able to change.

Also to clarify the tent weighs 150lbs. I only need that much weight when we'll be sleeping in it!
Click to expand...
Good luck with your project and promotion(s). Keep us posted about your locations and upload pictures when you can.
 
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#13 · (Edited)
i wouldnt do such
if you are going to go ahead with it i would recommend increasing contact points to the roof
to at least 6, to help distribute the weight
i had fist size rust holes at rear supports because i carry 76lb kayak
kayak acts like a sail and flexed rear contact points
i had to re engineer support structure
Pat comes with foam between roof skin and cross member, over time that foam breaks up and disintegrates
i replaced the foam with sheets of metal instead

Image


Image
 
#14 ·
This seems like a solution in search of a problem. I don't understand the advantage of a tent on top of a vehicle. It effectively immobilizes the vehicle and will likely result in damage to the roof. A standard tent can be any size you want, much more affordable, doesn't tie up the vehicle, and is easy to enter/exit. Obviously there's something I'm not getting.
 
#15 ·
if i was to do a multi month adventure like that
unless its on a safari i wouldnt go with roof tent
at least not in US
use the roof for storage that you wont need to access often, spare tire/emergency gear, etc..
that would free up space in the pat you can use
maybe a platform with storage underneath,
if a trailer is feasible look at offroad trailers and can set up a platform in or ontop of the trailer

do you plan on working in the tent? online blog or something?
you will want a more comfortable space for it
will you be staying at 1 place for extended stays? better to leave tent/trailer at the site while you do day trips
do have lots of options on how to go about it
would be curious to hear more about it
 
#16 ·
Okay, let's look at this from a rational perspective.

Let's say you want to support 500lbs on the stock crossbars. They attach to the Patriot's roof in four locations (a front and a rear attachment point at the end of each rail). That being said, you need to divide the total supported weight by 4 to see how much weight will be on each attachment point (let's call them "points" for simplicity).

500lbs / 4 points = 125lb/point

Based on Terasec's pics of the roof attachment points above, I would be sketchy about having 125lbs on one of those points for any great duration.

That said, if you can spread out the weight over a greater area of the roof, you can effectively keep your points safer, at the potential risk of flexing your roof panel somewhat.

LENGTHY ANECDOTE AHEAD:
I had a large plastic rooftop cargo carrier that I used to move cross-country over the course of a month. I didn't have crossbars, and the carrier was too narrow to sit on top of the rails. What it did have, however, was about 8 dense foam strips that ran crossways underneath the carrier. These distributed the weight over the entire roof panel. It did flex under the weight, but it didn't impact the interior headliner at all, and after the stuff was removed, the roof went right back into shape with no denting (there was some scuffing from where dirt had lodged under the foam, though). The rails simply kept the carrier from sliding around.

I am sure I had about 300lbs of stuff up there, for about a month straight. You could certainly feel the drag when driving, and you could feel the extra weight up high around sharp turns; however, the Patriot didn't feel unstable at all (if anything, having the extra weight helped it feel more planted if anything), and I haven't developed any weird roof leaks as a result. That was over 5 years ago.

So, if you add some foam supports (I'm thinking maybe something like yoga blocks? maybe something a little softer) between the tent and the roof that are strategically located over the internal crossmembers in the roof, you should be able to spread the weight enough to not impact the Patriot's structure significantly, if at all.

Creation had some pics of the roof crossmembers when he pulled his headliner, but they seem to have disappeared from his posts. Maybe he can post them back up?
 
#18 · (Edited)
Roof Top vs Conventional Tent

5speed said:
This seems like a solution in search of a problem. I don't understand the advantage of a tent on top of a vehicle. It effectively immobilizes the vehicle and will likely result in damage to the roof. A standard tent can be any size you want, much more affordable, doesn't tie up the vehicle, and is easy to enter/exit. Obviously there's something I'm not getting.
Click to expand...
I was kinda thinkin why roof top tents too!
I do not take extended trips but took and take 4 to 5 mini vacation trips a year.
Over the years I have both "pitched a tent" and Hooked up and plugged in a Rv on trips. I did not do primitive camping like I did in my "younger days". When tent camping, I would set up my tent ( which was more like a room away from home ) and stay in one location a minimum of 3 to 5 days. It's a lot of effort to set up a camp and when you do you stay...for a while.
On the other hand, when RVing I would cover much more ground over the course of my trip and with many of the benefits of modern living. Anywhere from overnighting to a first destination to multiple days at a given or multiple locations.

As I see it...Car Top Tents Benefits: (please note, this is definitely not an all inclusive list)
In terms of the benefits of roof top tents vs conventional equipment or lodging: economy, ease of set up and take down there by allowing more time to visit more venues. Additionally, the ability to carry more cargo and gear in the cab.
When seeking solitude, remote habitats can have venomous snakes and large predators / animals. Being off the ground makes good sense. Not to mention avoiding ground and low flying insects.
Weather wise, in rainy conditions being off the ground can be a big plus. Provided one doesn't slip off the latter climbing of course!
TBC.

:wink2:
 
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Discussion starter · #19 ·
Appreciate all the insight guys! I just did 3 months on the road out of a sprinter van (camping 1/3 of the time). I learned a lot along this trip which included things I needed and things I definitely did not.

Here is what I'm doing:
2-3 months on the road (United States and Mexico) shooting photography for various clients (surf, camping, cars, outdoors). It'll be me, a friend and my dog. Sometimes we'll be places for more than a few days, others not.

Here is the reasons why roof top tent makes the most sense for my application:
- Have you ever slept in one? It's a memory foam mattress pad.
- I need the interior space for my camera gear. I'll have 3 1650 Pelican cases in there (along with a Yeti 65, clothes, recovery stuff, bear can, random hiking/surfing/MTB gear)
- I'll have my small dog (puppy) with me. She's small and I'd like to keep her away from the ground should anything think that she might be an easy eat
- I think somebody touched on it but the rain/snow and being off the ground is an awesome combination
- Trailer isn't feasible due to some sponsorship stuff that requires the bike hitch be on the hitch (trust me I weighed heavily on this idea)

I've given a lot of thought on this (and frankly if I didn't still owe on the Jeep I'd get a truck BUT that's not an option and I have to work with what I've got). I'll take a look into the foam displacement. I'm also curious to see how much the RRO rails/crossbars handle weight.
 
#20 ·
with that in mind
if you go ahead with roof tent
few things i would consider
replacing side rails with rails that extend the full length of the roof
that will increase contacts points to 6
cut rubber blocks and place them in a few places under side rails between the contact points, that will help further distribute the weight
have poles that slip under the platform to the ground to help take load off the roof when your all up there sleeping

just some things to consider
 
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Garrett
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