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Some pics of my little trip + the stuck and no revs problem again...

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Tyler-98-W68

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Discussion starter · #1 · (Edited)
So a few days ago I went for a little romp around the mountains in the southern part of Alberta. Mostly around the Beaver Lake Mines area and around the Castle special management area.

I took tons of pictures but can't post them all.

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Now for the good pictures

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Happy I'm stuck no more :pepper:

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You'll notice in the final few pics showing me "stuck" i have to admit those pictures were taken after I got the pat rocking and then it was easy to get out. What happened was i "thought" the snow was hard packed enough to go over it. Anyhow started to go through with some speed and BAM sunk right through.

ESP FULL OFF was used the whole time

Then the stupid problem of the no revs happened again but only in 4x4 Locked and in low. As long as I didn't lock it in 4x4 or just left it in D with 4x4 I was able to spin the tires as much as I wanted to, although with much reduced BLD performance. In the time I was stuck (about an hour) I got to mess around with all the different modes and found that, when there is sufficient weight on all 4 tires(it varies from situation to situation of course), once in the 4x4 LOW mode (FDII) the engine simply doesn't have enough torque to turn the other wheel (when i say other wheel, the one that isn't having the brakes applied due to spinning) I observed this when my revs wouldn't go past 2000rpms or so. Hard to tell from the pictures but the passenger rear tire would spin the easiest so it would start to spin but then slow down (BLD working) and the drivers rear tire would try to start spinning ever so slightly.


Once out of the Low 4x4 mode, I could spin the tires as much as i needed to to get out, although the pat was acting more like it had an open diff.

I know this is really long and drawn out and sucks without a video, and while i'd love to go out and get stuck the same way and take a video I don't have a camera for that. Either way i'm not dissappointed in the performance of my pat at all, i got unstuck and still had a ton of fun, just wanted to share my experience.

Still love my Pat to death and can't wait to go out again, I actually might be heading out tomorrow so i might have some more pics soon
 
Discussion starter · #7 ·
Yes the stock tires suck, although the point of my trip wasn't to even get stuck, although my judgement got the better of me and I ended up where I did:icon_rolleyes:

Winter tires wouldn't have helped me get out, as you can see in the snow I had the underside of the body on the snow, so ground clearance was the problem. One upside though was i left the pat running, so especially near the front, the heat from the engine melted the snow away.

No burning smell, although I wasn't thrashing from drive to reverse while trying to get out;)

I'm going to be heading out there again shortly, although there has been alot of snow there so I'll see how far I can get, getting stuck is not an option today because I feel too lazy.

Thanks for the comments, now someone from southern alberta come out with me!
 
#10 ·
I have experienced the same two things in terms of the type of snow and the loss of power.

Last week I was on a back road that the wind had blown the snow around. In some places the hard wind packed snow was blown across the road. Even though at that altitude, 9,200 ft, the snow is usually fairly dry and soft the wind pack becomes very hard.

As I drove through one flat wind packed part I kept the speed up. I could feel the front skid plate floating on the snow. I was able to keep the power up and did not get stuck but it was close.

The lack of power, apparently the engine becomes detuned, has occurred twice. Both times it was on a steep section of old rough mining roads at about 12,000 feet elevation. But I tried drive, 4 x 4, and low range 4 x 4 and it did not seem to change the loss of power.

Later, I also tried to duplicate the loss of power on a paved road and the gravel shoulder. The section of road was also steep and the elevation was actually higher, about 13,800 ft, but I did not get the loss of power.
 
#11 ·
Beautiful pictures, Tyler. What a great place to live.
I'm inclined to go along with the tyre issue, I've been out in some deepish stuff last week where even a good spin won't pull you out without some aggressive profile on your boots. The tyres that are available over here for a Patriot are really too 'roady'. There've been a few postings about this over the past year. I can't understand why Jeep chose a wheel spec that offered such a limiting choice of rubberware.

Rocal
 
Discussion starter · #12 ·
Well I took a spin out to the same places I was at last time although the highways were getting worse the closer I got to the mountains, basically whiteout conditions so i'll be going back in a day or 2 and see what kind of trouble I can get into. Snapped a quick picture, nothing special (my camera sucks, or I just don't know how to use it.)

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#13 · (Edited)
Burning Brake Smell

inouk said:
Nah, I was talking about brakes.

To me, it happens every time when the brake lock diff kicks in and are working for a little too long time ...
Click to expand...

I have noticed the burning brakes smell after playing in the snow on the streets and winging it around corners in 4x4 D (ESP partial), revving up to thrust out of a slide.... Even with only 5-10 minutes and maybe only 6 or 8 corners, I can smell it after backing into the garage.

I wasnt sure if it was the BLD (and ESP) causing brake heat-up, or if it was perhaps the friction elements of the centre coupler overheated ...and venting

I'm guessing brakes.
 
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Discussion starter · #14 · (Edited)
As promised I decided to head out again to the mountains, and all I can say is that there was a ton of snow there, once again had a blast in my Pat:pepper:


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Also had a chance to get myself "stuck" but with a way to get out to test the no rev problems again.

While on an incline with about 3 inches of fresh snow from a dead stop it didn't matter whether I had the 4x4 locked or not (while in D) it was acting just like an open diff, although in the 4x4 lock mode everyonce in a while the BLD would sometimes kick in but never provide enough power to be of any use to the tire that wasn't spinning. But during this time I had no problem spinning and reving the crap out of the engine (I don't do that as its not entirely healthy:))

Once I put it in 4x4 Locked Low mode, the damn thing did the same thing as before, about 2300ish rpms and it would just sit there and basically do nothing, every once in a while the tires would start to spin a bit, but nothing usefull, however I figured out a solution, leave the gear shifter in L but take off 4x4 lock, get the wheels spinning and the revs up and put it into the offroad mode and that would get the wheels spinning enough that I was able to get unstuck, although i'm sure the revs would drop down again.

I'm not convinced anything is wrong with my Pat but i'm sure it has to do with lack of torque. I don't think its the cvt limiting anything as the pat's engine was really trying to spin the wheels but to no avail. This problem doesn't happen when you have 2 wheels up in the air in a cross axle type hang up probably because its very simple for the computer to see zero traction on the 2 wheels and apply the BLD, but when 4 wheels on the ground with traction it becomes a bit of a problem.

I'm sorry if this is boring and long winded but I'm really trying to test out all the different types of situations one might encounter.



psaulesl: Today i definately smelled something, although it smelled more like coolant than anything else, not sure what it could be.

APT: your right about the 4 wheels and too much traction (roots blower anyone:smiley_thumbs_up:)
 
#15 ·
I know there is a software update for the CVT not sure if that is what it is
 
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Discussion starter · #16 ·
I took a look through the TSB's last night and the only one I could find that applies to my Pat, well at least by model year was the ESP Full Off fix, and i've never had a problem getting my esp to go into full off mode, I might take it to the dealer and have a talk with them,
 
Discussion starter · #17 ·
http://jeep-patriot.ucoz.ua/const/mud.wmv

I found this interesting video in the members gallery section. It shows exactly what i've been trying to describe.

As you can see while going through the mud, the pat gets somewhat stuck and stops then you can hear the revs come up and stop right around the 2500 mark and the pat does nothing, then eventually the front tire starts to spin and then it magically gets out.

If you look closely at the driver rear wheel and the articulation there is ALOT of weight put on that particular tire, and the rest are on the ground, further proving that there is sure something limiting the engine from rev'ing (whether it be torque or ctv stall speed ect)

It just bugs me that I can spin the tires like crazy in the non off-road mode, yet through it in that mode and this happens.
 
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inouk
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