I am looking to get a pop-up camper. The thing is, it weighs about 1,870lbs. I am sure I'll be able to pull it, but is the oil cooler really necessary? I know the dealer is going to charge a buttload to put it on and I think I can do without it. Opinions anyone?
towing a camper...
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The 2.4L will have no problem whatsoever towing a pop-up weighing less that 2000lbs. Give it a try and you'll see what I mean. The oil cooler is only necessary if you plan on trucking it up mountains all the time.
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This has been covered many times. Why do you think it's not necessary? Why is the factory recommending it not enough for you? Might as well ignore the factory maintenance schedule while your at it. After all, those maintenance intervals are not really needed are they? You can change your oil every 15,000 miles. You're vehicle will still run.
I suggest you follow the factory recommendations.
- Dan M
I suggest you follow the factory recommendations.
- Dan M
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One thing to keep in mind is that you will likely have hundreds of pounds of gear in addition to the trailer weight. If you fill up the water reservoir on the trailer that will add a lot of weight right there.
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I've towed a 6x6x12 box trailer weighing right around 2000lbs uphill and against the wind with no oil cooler. No probs. Just my experience. A pop up with no wind resistance will be even easier. Used a lot of gas but no apparent heat issues. The engine temp held steady at right under 50%. Only time the engine ever got hotter than that was when I got stuck in quicksand on my latest trailride. Had to pop the hood for a quick cooldown but no mechanical failures. Doens't the jeep "tell you" if the oil gets too hot?
Of course an oil cooler is a good idea! And highly reccomended. I say get it. But I don't have one. Don't need one.
There are at least a dozen threads on this topic, probably located in engine and drivetrain.
Of course an oil cooler is a good idea! And highly reccomended. I say get it. But I don't have one. Don't need one.
There are at least a dozen threads on this topic, probably located in engine and drivetrain.
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Remember that most tow ratings are based on vehicle and 175 lb driver (i know it is more complicated but work with me here)
So the wife, the buddies, the kids, the water, the beer, the burgers, all this extra weight has to either be added to the dry weight of your pop up or subtracted from the max towing capacity.
To each his own though
So the wife, the buddies, the kids, the water, the beer, the burgers, all this extra weight has to either be added to the dry weight of your pop up or subtracted from the max towing capacity.
To each his own though
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The limit is 1500 lbs without the cooler, 2000 lbs with the cooler/tow group.
You may have no issues towing 2000 lbs, however once temperatures get up around 25-35 C (75-90 F) you are asking for serious trouble. The extra cooler will give you some needed overhead. You will also greatly reduce wear on the engine.
You may have no issues towing 2000 lbs, however once temperatures get up around 25-35 C (75-90 F) you are asking for serious trouble. The extra cooler will give you some needed overhead. You will also greatly reduce wear on the engine.
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You need one of these.
View attachment 4087
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Also keep in mind that the factory recommendations are usually very conservative. So if they are followed, the likelyhood of failure is very slim and they won't get sued.
If you don't follow them, and tow 2500lbs, or don't use an oil cooler, etc... then your likelyhood of failure goes up. There's no way of knowing what the odds become. But maybe it was 1000:1 using factory specs, and now it's 100:1.
It's your ride, use it like you want too. Just be prepared. If it overheats and causes damage while towing a 2000lb trailer without a cooler, get ready for Jeep to say no to your warranty if they can prove what you were doing.
If you don't follow them, and tow 2500lbs, or don't use an oil cooler, etc... then your likelyhood of failure goes up. There's no way of knowing what the odds become. But maybe it was 1000:1 using factory specs, and now it's 100:1.
It's your ride, use it like you want too. Just be prepared. If it overheats and causes damage while towing a 2000lb trailer without a cooler, get ready for Jeep to say no to your warranty if they can prove what you were doing.
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I think your better off paying the small cost of the oil cooler up front in the beginning than the large cost of damage as a result of excessive engine wear in the long run. I tow a cargo trailer (2000 lbs) with my Pat (2.4L) and have had no problems. I got the oil cooler because it was recommended and I was afraid that the warrantee would not be covered if I was towing more than 1500 lbs without the recommended oil cooler.
But hey...its your car..not mine!
But hey...its your car..not mine!
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Hahahaha! Hell yes! Do they make those for the Patriot??
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I love Camping and Boating, but it's so tough to get away and plan a day with everyone. Work, School and so many conflicting pressures....
Time and time again, owners of Boats and Campers just seem to have them parked at home watching them rust away.
For most working people, if you can do two Boating trips and two Camping Trips a year you are doing much better than most.
Given the cost and price of ownership and storage.. you can't beat the deal of renting a cabin or a boat when and where you need them.
I think if you are the hardcore outdoors type with all the heavy toys - The Patriot was probably the wrong choice.
Time and time again, owners of Boats and Campers just seem to have them parked at home watching them rust away.
For most working people, if you can do two Boating trips and two Camping Trips a year you are doing much better than most.
Given the cost and price of ownership and storage.. you can't beat the deal of renting a cabin or a boat when and where you need them.
I think if you are the hardcore outdoors type with all the heavy toys - The Patriot was probably the wrong choice.
Whatever you decide to do, get a Scangauge to monitor engine oil, coolant, and trans temps. While I have no idea how effective the OEM engine oil cooler is, it does increase tow rating from 1k to 2k pounds. Considering you live in the south with summer temps well over 90* and high humidity that forces A/C use, you want all the cooling you can get.
Most RV manufacturers all but lie about the weight of their trailers. Unloaded vehicle weight or dry axle weight are misleading. You should assume the weight of the trailer as ready to camp will be 15% higher, plus all your camping gear.
Electric brakes required.
Most tow vehicles will hit GVWR before GCWR or the theoretical tow rating. We only have about 1000 pounds of payload. 4 passengers, luggage/cargo/gear plus tongue weight often puts the vehicle over GVWR.
Most RV manufacturers all but lie about the weight of their trailers. Unloaded vehicle weight or dry axle weight are misleading. You should assume the weight of the trailer as ready to camp will be 15% higher, plus all your camping gear.
Electric brakes required.
Most tow vehicles will hit GVWR before GCWR or the theoretical tow rating. We only have about 1000 pounds of payload. 4 passengers, luggage/cargo/gear plus tongue weight often puts the vehicle over GVWR.
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457 Posts
Also, keep in mind that the 2.4L world engine is a CAR engine, not a truck engine. That means less torque at lower RPM's than what truck engines produce. low end torque is what you want for starting with a trailer.
peak hp/torque is in the 6000+ rpm range according to Chrysler press releases.
if you're cruising along at 3000-3500 rpm you're in the neighborhood of 75 horses and probably slightly less torque.
according to various dyno numbers I've seen (using different chrysler vehicles with same 2.4L world engine) you're not over 100 horses and torque until you hit around 4300 rpms.
My FDII runs < 3500 rpm driving 80 with no trailer.
2008 dodge avenger 2.4L curb weight 3355
2009 jeep patriot 2.4L curb weight 3168
check out the k&n dyno for the 2.4L avenger air intake
http://www.kandn.com/dynocharts/69-2542_dyno.pdf
- Dan M
peak hp/torque is in the 6000+ rpm range according to Chrysler press releases.
if you're cruising along at 3000-3500 rpm you're in the neighborhood of 75 horses and probably slightly less torque.
according to various dyno numbers I've seen (using different chrysler vehicles with same 2.4L world engine) you're not over 100 horses and torque until you hit around 4300 rpms.
My FDII runs < 3500 rpm driving 80 with no trailer.
2008 dodge avenger 2.4L curb weight 3355
2009 jeep patriot 2.4L curb weight 3168
check out the k&n dyno for the 2.4L avenger air intake
http://www.kandn.com/dynocharts/69-2542_dyno.pdf
- Dan M
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397 Posts
So true. My last truck was an S10 Chevy Blazer. Honestly, smaller inside than my 2.0 Patriot. And, eventhough it was 6 cylinder (and of course my Pat is a small 4 cylinder), the Pat would actually feel much more nimble off the starting gate. Granted, the Pat is much lighter car, but mainly it was all about Torque. The blazer's 4.6L Vortex engine was very low torque. I could tow a big boat with no problem, and well, sometimes It felt like I was always towing a boat which mght explain the 12mpg.
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457 Posts
My last truck was an 02 dakota quad cab 4x4 with 4.7L V8 (with no redline). The 4.7 magnum engine is a great engine to rev. It had a class IV (10,000 lb hitch) and was rated to tow over 6,000 lbs. The Superchips tuner was awesome on that truck and firmed the shift like you wouldn't believe.
I loved to have fun in that truck. I beat an S10 off the line at a red light going up hill towing a trailer with 2,000 lbs of landscape rock. Truck with me in it was ~5300 lbs (tool box, shell, skid plates, etc). Trailer was ~900 lbs and then the 2,000 lb rock.
The look on the s10s drivers face was priceless. He was following behind me until we stopped at the red light, then he hopped out from behind me into the next lane as it to quickly accelerate and pass me when the light turned green.
I had the heavy duty service group and towing package on that truck. It had cooler, larger alternator, factory 7pin wiring (RV), factory hitch. The 03 had larger brakes and added towing capability.
My truck prior to that was 95 dakota club cab 4x4 with 3.9L V6. I added hitch to it and it worked. It ran hotter towing with no cooler. That's why I recommend the cooler and will no longer tow without one.
- Dan M
I loved to have fun in that truck. I beat an S10 off the line at a red light going up hill towing a trailer with 2,000 lbs of landscape rock. Truck with me in it was ~5300 lbs (tool box, shell, skid plates, etc). Trailer was ~900 lbs and then the 2,000 lb rock.
The look on the s10s drivers face was priceless. He was following behind me until we stopped at the red light, then he hopped out from behind me into the next lane as it to quickly accelerate and pass me when the light turned green.
I had the heavy duty service group and towing package on that truck. It had cooler, larger alternator, factory 7pin wiring (RV), factory hitch. The 03 had larger brakes and added towing capability.
My truck prior to that was 95 dakota club cab 4x4 with 3.9L V6. I added hitch to it and it worked. It ran hotter towing with no cooler. That's why I recommend the cooler and will no longer tow without one.
- Dan M
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The thing you can't see is that the camper part has a set of pony wheels to keep the 5 from doing a back flip.
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My Pat`s local technical specs say that I can tow 1.500 kilos = 3.300 Lbs! And I don`t have a clue if it has an oil cooler or not. How do I find out? Is there another small radiator in front of the big standard one, or where should I look for it? Or does this concern only autostick CVT models?
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