[Prushinfox001]

After my lift was properly installed by a certified mechanic onto my 2014 Jeep Patriot Sport 4x4 2.4L. Automatic 6 speed. I began to experience vibration and slight wobble on the front passenger side upon acceleration and some turning. I am currently running Cragar soft 8 17” rims with Cooper ATs as the idea of the lift was to run a larger tire and the kit did not have a disclosure or warning regarding this.

A few months later the right CV axle assembly failed. The vehicle is now at the shop that installed the lift and they can’t eliminate this problem even with OEM replacement and Moog replacement new parts. All associated drive line components were ruled out to include engine mounts. It is surmised that the lift places undue stress on the axle and components because the geometry of the factory driveline has been compromised beyond factory engineering spec and the design of the kit should have included a modified cv axle shaft or specific warnings.

After researching the web I have come to find overwhelming evidence that this is a known issue by consumers and was acknowledged by RRO. I have collected all the URLs and statements.

I believe that it is now RROs responsibility to back their product and step in to mitigate this issue by contacting my mechanic and trouble shooting this design flaw.

Please contact XXXXXXXXXXX to resolve this. I would also request that RRO be held responsible for the repairs citing negligence in design, build, deploy. This vehicle was never taken off road and had a state inspection prior to the lift being installed. This vehicle has been in the shop for three business days as of the date of this email. Also it should be noted that this vehicle had less than 45000 miles on it prior to lift installation with no previous modifications or structural/cosmetic repairs.

I also had a 2008 Jeep Patriot that had an RRO lift installed and the same issue occurred leading me to sell the vehicle to avoid costly repairs. This Jeep was a manual transmission.

I will publish a chronology of my experience with your customer service on the Jeep Patriot Forum site for the benefit of all consumers as there should be absolute transparency with this. I will also relinquish all receipts for the lift install and history of service for the vehicle if requested to demonstrate that this Jeep was meticulously cared for and not driven outside of manufacturer recommendations.

I request expedited review of this. Thank you.

Sincerely




Sent from my iPhone

 

[Prushinfox001]

The automated response. If Jeep certified these kits why then is my warranty voided by its installation?

Again, there was no issue with the incorrect installation especially with the axle spline side. The problem is clearance of the transmission side axle components. This is exactly the response I expected. So I ask RRO to publish the proof that this lift kit is approved by the manufacturer along with a CAD or engineering diagram showing driveline component clearance specs for all of us to see.




We are very sorry for your frustration and difficulty involved with the installation of the lift kit on your Jeep.
We do have many thousands of kits on Jeep around the world, trouble-free. Jeep and MOPAR certified the kits to be offered as a dealer installed option. The only reason this didn't happen is that we could not meet Jeep's production requirements.
It is good to recognize and understand that Jeep certified these kits for use on their vehicles, new, installed by dealerships.

That said, some people have had installation errors.

As a result of the installation issues, we recently changed our installation instructions to include a warning to installers regarding the front axles. What we found is that some installers, allow the axles to slip out of the spline side gears inside the differential. This puts pressure on the axle, CV, and boot, and can lead to problems. The instructions now include notes on this and the recommendation to knock the axle with a rubber mallet to make certain the axle is fully seated at its spline back into the differential. We added this recommendation because of in small % of installations, this has happened. We do hope this additional note in our install instructions can assist installers who are prone to making these types of mistakes, or may not be paying close attention to this matter.

Certainly you can send back the lift kit for a refund if your installer is unable to perform a correct and safe installation for you.


Unfortunately we cannot control the installation of the kits.
What we can do, is design kits in conjunction with Jeep/Mopar to make sure they operate correctly. As such, they have provided many thousands of Jeep owners around the world with a great deal of pleasure in their vehicle. It really is unfortunate some installers have made errors and decide the blame is not on them... that they know more than the Jeep engineers who have approved the design.

You can send back for a refund though if you wish. Simply make sure your name is on and in the package so we know who it came from. If you do not have the original receipt, you can send to...
Rocky Road Outfitters
1920 Wendell Lane
Heber City, UT 84032




Also good for you to be aware that any other lift on the market currently, is a direct duplicate of our own kit as they are now being mass-produced in China under poor quality control measures. So any lift, from any company, will be the same design as what you have, only with lower standards of production. Patent law being what it is for small companies... we have no recourse for the design being stolen and reproduced overseas :^(





Rocky Road Outfitters
www.rocky-road.com
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http://www.facebook.com/pages/Rocky-Road-Outfitters/128883420486195

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On Sat, Oct 20, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Mark Polaski <[email protected]> wrote:

 

[zoner99]

This is an issue that is occasionally reported by Patriot/Compass owners who install the RRO lift, as you have mentioned. I'm glad to hear that RRO has included the potential issue of the axle being out of position at the differential, no doubt that occurs in some cases.
The following is just my personal thoughts on the matter FWIW. Assuming there are no actual problems such as worn ball joints (speaking generally here, I read that you have checked everything) if this issue occurs it is related to the weights and dimensions of the wheel and tire, and how that affects the drivetrain including the motor and transaxle. In your case, 17" steel wheels plus AT tires, and substantial change in offset, is probably the worst case scenario due to the weight and position.
The engine/transaxle is mounted on flexible mounts, essentially it is 'secured' with rubber, and it can move substantially. It will 'twist' in response to the torque created during acceleration. The vehicle itself also 'twists', mostly, the front end tends to lift. That in itself is perfectly normal but these particular engine mounts aren't the best. Many owners report excessive vibration while in gear but not moving and the engine only at idle.
You could think of the engine/transaxle as a weight on one end of the flexible shaft, and the wheel and tire as a weight on the other end. Less offset adds some leverage you could say; the effect of the heavier wheel/tire is multiplied. The shaft itself of course has two flexible joints also. This is an assembly that can certainly develop some oscillation and shaft deflection.
The combination of all these factors can lead to excessive movement that potentially could lead to premature failure of parts including the CV joints.

Speculating again, but when you look at the Rough Country lift which adds some spring preload and less front spacer height, you can see a potential solution.

In your particular case a lighter wheel/tire combination, and more positive offset, would also be helpful IMO.

 

[breadtruck]

Ive read a lot of feedback suggesting the RRO kit was designed for the first years of Patriot (2007-2010.)
Since the second series (2011-2017) sits a little higher with taller springs, the belief was it was just enough extra height to cause the issues.

But if you have a 2008 that did it also, then maybe there's more to it. Was it a FD2, which would have the taller springs?

 

[Prushinfox001]

RRO just told me over the phone that I will have to purchase a Toyota Tacoma part to solve this issue. They acknowledged that this was a known issue and the customer service agent was surly with me when I pressed him as to why they didn’t disclose this in the kit or on their website. He also stated that with lift kits “all kinds of problems can crop up”. This kit was advertised as a plug and play. They would not call my garage and discuss this with them. So I am screwed. I intend to pursue this with my states Attorney Generals office and I’ll present all the information I’ve collected. My Patriot is now in the shop on day 4. OEM parts won’t do it as the vibration is really bad and the mounts and transmission are fine. Buyer beware. I’ll also be presenting what I found on my consumer blog. All I wanted RRO to do was make it right.

 

[Prushinfox001]

I am running Cragar soft 8s. Aluminum. There shouldn’t be an issue as the offset is minimal too. If this would be an issue RRO should have had recommendations as such. The idea of the lift is to add larger tires/wheels. In sum this vehicle should not be lifted as it wasn’t designed for it. I learned a hard lesson that’s going to cost me a lot. I was more disappointed by RROs customer service rep being adversarial. I’m pretty laid back and just wanted them to talk to my garage. Yeesh.

 

[Sandstone]

RRO just told me over the phone that I will have to purchase a Toyota Tacoma part to solve this issue.

Which Tacoma part?

 

[Esanchez8701]

Hey Prushinfox001. I also contacted RRO since I purchased their lift kit for my 2015 compass. It seems I get the wobble under hard acceleration. Did your shop "knock the axle with a rubber mallet to make certain the axle is fully seated at its spline back into the differential?" I am curious because I am going to my shop again this Sat to have the suspension specialists take another look. There has to be something that can be done to lessen the stress on the CV joints. Even an upgraded cv axle that would be adjustable would help. I am running 235/70/17 tires on the OEM '17 wheel.

 

[Sandstone]

Did you ask about the Toyota Tacoma part that RRO told Prushin he needed?
I'd still like to know what it was.

 

[Esanchez8701]

Hi Sandstone I have not asked them about the Toyota Tacoma part. I honesty think that was BS coming from the RRO company. I just hope I do not have to remove this kit, because if I do then I need to buy new tires, and hope my cv joints are not screwed. There aren't many lift kits for the Jeep Compass / Patriot. I have looked at the other kits. There is one by American Trail which uses Coil Springs, and body spacers which would potentially apply unwanted pressure.

 

[Sandstone]

Ok, thanks.

I just looked at American Trail, they show lifts for the new compass and renegade but I didn't see one for the MK Patriot.
Do you have a link?

And BTW, welcome.

 

[Esanchez8701]

This is what I did find from Quadratec which is a good site. Thank Sandstone I hope to get more light on this issue.

2007-2016 Patriot (MK) Lift Kits | Quadratec

www.quadratec.com

 

[Sandstone]

Ah I see, thanks for that.

Was it the Rough Country lift you were thinking of?

The Daystar kit they show is actually for the new compass:

kj09171bk | Lift & Leveling Kit | Jeep Compass | 2017-2019

Daystar's complete 1.5 inch Lift/Leveling kit for your 2017-2019 Jeep Compass, will give you added ground clearance, the option of 28.3 in tires and reduce your NVH, all while working with-in the factory suspension design. Covered by a Lifetime Warranty kj09171bk

www.daystarsuspensionparts.com

Let us know when you hear anything from RRO.

 

[Esanchez8701]

No problem. I am a little pissed since I did not want to throw the lift on, and deal with these issues in the long run. The rough country kit looks similar. I think most of the kits are going to add stress to the joints unless you slightly modify them. I will keep you posted after I take it to suspension shop who installed it.

 

[Esanchez8701]

Just an update I tried reaching out to them over their chat utility on their website which they refused to answer, but when I disguised myself under a new name, and had questions about a different car they replied "go Ahead". LOL talk about pathetic. I searched this forum to find a contact by the name of Glenn who I emailed a few minutes ago lets see what happens.

 

[Esanchez8701]

Also for more information check these out: I am asking them some questions before I pull the trigger on this.

Murchison Patriot / Compass 2.0" Suspension System | Murchison Products - 07 3205 5011 - Brisbane Jeep, Ram, Service Centre and Aftermarket Parts Specialists

www.murchisonproducts.com.au

 

[Sandstone]

That's what I have, STU's plus a small spacer lift that I made:

DIY Spacer Lift Kit w/ STUCoils - Installed

I put these on a few months back along with a new set of Monroe struts and STUCoils. I already had STUCoils, which gave about an inch over stock on my FDII but I wanted to get more lift without any binding of the inner CV joints (especially the front drivers side) when running disconected...

www.jeeppatriot.com

 

[Esanchez8701]

So now I am thinking If I run the STU coils with the RRO strut spacers front/rear would that be safe? or would I remove the strut spacers, and just rock the STU coils? would I still have the same issue with the shuddering under acceleration from a dead stop. I do not want to put any stress on the CV joints at all like I am now.

 

[Sandstone]

The spacers for the RRO are about 1 3/4 if memory serves, my spacers are only 1", so I don't think adding Stu's to the RRO will fix what's happening.

Most people don't have vibration problems on acceleration with Stu's, I didn't.
But the springs alone won't lift as high as RRO. That's why I added the small spacer.

The difference is how coils lift vs spacers.

Lift coils have a different spring rate than stock. They don't let the vehicle settle as far down, but they don't move the range of strut travel with respect to the inner cv joint.

Whether stock springs or Stu's, the maximum angle the CV joint sees is the same on full extension.

Spacers move the range of strut travel with respect to the inner cv joint, so on full extension the inner cv joint will see an increase in angle.

The max angle on the inner joint is about 23 degrees before they start to bind, and the motor mounts flex on acceleration so that can change the angle too.

The rough country lift is kind of like adding a spacer lift to a spring lift, but instead of different springs they add the coil spring spacer which pre-loads the springs.

Does that make sense?

 

[Esanchez8701]

Stuck in traffic on a rainy evening lol. Thank goodness tomorrow is Friday. I really appreciate your input here. I think the safest thing to do would be the STU coil setup with the small spacer like you did. So now my question is for my 2015 Compass could I buy a already manufactured “1 strut spacer for the front, and rear? I’m guessing I would remove the entire RRO lift kit components.