Trans overheat light.....sorta..... - Jeep Patriot Forums
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post #1 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-08-2019, 01:56 PM Thread Starter
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Trans overheat light.....sorta.....

So this morning on my way to work I was on the highway moving with traffic at 70MPH. I heard a ding and looked down and my trans temp light was on.

History: with about 50K on my jeep after purchasing new I got the dreaded trans temp light, loud whine, and degraded performance. I went to the dealer and got the usual routine. "We didn't find any active or stored codes in the computer. There is nothing wrong with your Patriot". I had them do a transmission service with new fluid and filters anyway. After much discussion on this forum it was noted that the service intervals simply do not work. So I thought I would play it safe and change the fluid and filters myself every 50K. I changed them at 100K, and again at 150K. I am now at 193K miles. not far from another self imposed fluid/ filter change interval.

Differences: This time, there was no loud whine and no degraded performance. The light came on and I heard the chime. I kept going for a mile or so until I saw a good spot to pull over. When I did, I put the trans in neutral and sat there. The light went out in about 3 minutes. I sat there for another 5 minutes or so just to let the pump circulate the fluid and then back in gear and back on the road. No issues the rest of the way. I never got any abnormal noise or any degraded performance. The Patriot kept trucking right along at 65MPH until I pulled over.

I am getting ready to change the fluid again, but I am a little concerned that this did not seem to follow the "normal" pattern of what happens when that light comes on. Since the last change I have done quite a bit more towing. Nothing over the limits, just my zero turn on a 6x8 utility trailer to mow another piece of property I bought and hauling trash and lumber for projects. The most I have towed would be between 1200-1400 lbs. In my mind that makes me think the fluid has degraded faster this time and would explain the light. I'm not too worried that I can change the fluid and filters and it will be fine. Just a little concerned that there my be something else entirely going on since I never got the loud wine or degraded performance.

Any thoughts?

2014 Black Jeep Patriot, Latitude, FDII, Sun and Sound package, remote start
2015 White Jeep Grand Cherokee, Limited, Luxury group II
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post #2 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-08-2019, 03:01 PM

 
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You might want to get a scangauge or put Torque on your phone so you can monitor the trans temp directly and see how hot it thinks it is.

According to the manual, the TCM also uses data from other temp sensors, like oil, intake, coolant, and ambient air to calculate for certain conditions, so maybe one of those is an outlier and causing an issue.

Also, I don't know if this is any help or not, but a mechanic on the NICO boards posted about how the coolant mix being off can cause a problem.

https://forums.nicoclub.com/rogue-cv...s-t563940.html

Last edited by Sandstone; 04-08-2019 at 03:14 PM.
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post #3 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-08-2019, 04:32 PM
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Maybe stop towing a trailer as the so-called weak cvt can not handle the load ? Maybe get a Pickup Truck to haul or tow things. My 2 cents.

Yes, the economy has gotten better....
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post #4 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-08-2019, 06:01 PM
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You might consider replacing the CVT Cooler filter. All patriot CVT's are equipped with them (not just 08-10). It's easy to do just remove the battery hold down bracket and the cover plate is right there. You will need the Filter and O-Ring just search Ebay for: "JF011E-RE0F10A-CVT-COOLER-RETURN" for the filter and: "Nissan-216061XF0A-Overheating-CVT-Transmission-Oil-Cooler-O-RING" for the O-ring.

I also recommend 30k between CVT Oil change intervals under normal driving, if your towing you might consider 20K. You can purchase 12 quarts of Mopar CVT fluid on Ebay for $88 shipped. if you have the have the aftermarket oil pan with drain plug you can change your CVT fluid twice for that price.
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post #5 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-08-2019, 09:21 PM
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Might your tranny be low on fluid? Twice I had leaks, both fixed under warranty. There were no symptoms, i.e., no spots on the garage floor and no performance problems. It could be overheating because of less fluid to dissipate the heat.
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post #6 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-08-2019, 11:12 PM
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Hrm, I've heard of too much fluid causing it to whine and foam, but too little is an interesting thought. Changing that extra filter might help, as the higher revs from it being a FD2 probably aren't doing very much good. 50k should be just fine for a fluid/filter change interval, though 30k is of course a bit safer.

Some things that may interest you though:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B009PJJG1Q...riotconvert-20 Side note, this will stick out of the CVT fill tube about 6 inches too far when fully inserted and therefore should not be left in.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00Z7NXLPQ...riotconvert-20

https://www.amsoil.com/shop/by-produ...tic-cvt-fluid/

https://www.amazon.com/Valvoline-Con...smission+fluid

https://www.amazon.com/Jeep-Patriot-...gateway&sr=8-1

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post #7 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-09-2019, 01:03 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandstone View Post
You might want to get a scangauge or put Torque on your phone so you can monitor the trans temp directly and see how hot it thinks it is.

According to the manual, the TCM also uses data from other temp sensors, like oil, intake, coolant, and ambient air to calculate for certain conditions, so maybe one of those is an outlier and causing an issue.

Also, I don't know if this is any help or not, but a mechanic on the NICO boards posted about how the coolant mix being off can cause a problem.

https://forums.nicoclub.com/rogue-cv...s-t563940.html
Interesting. I had not seen this. Thank you. After reading through this post there is some information that I had not considered at all. I did drain and refill the coolant about a month ago. I simply mixed the coolant 50/50 with water and dumped it in. I don't have a refractometer or any other way of testing the protection temp of the coolant. I would have never even thought it was that important. Perhaps this is the missing link and I caused this issue myself by doing what I otherwise considered preventive maintenance. I had not done a drain/flush/refill since I bought the Patriot. at the time it was at about 180K. I have never had engine cooling issues, but just figured it was well past time to do it, so I did.

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2015 White Jeep Grand Cherokee, Limited, Luxury group II

Last edited by DangerAaron; 04-09-2019 at 01:54 PM.
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post #8 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-09-2019, 01:10 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Earthworm51 View Post
Maybe stop towing a trailer as the so-called weak cvt can not handle the load ? Maybe get a Pickup Truck to haul or tow things. My 2 cents.
It's rated to tow 2000 lbs. I am not nor have I ever exceeded that. I have other vehicles that I do use when towing heavier items like my tractor, or other larger loads. I see no reason to not use it as long as I am not going over it's rated capacity.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TKPat View Post
You might consider replacing the CVT Cooler filter. All patriot CVT's are equipped with them (not just 08-10). It's easy to do just remove the battery hold down bracket and the cover plate is right there. You will need the Filter and O-Ring just search Ebay for: "JF011E-RE0F10A-CVT-COOLER-RETURN" for the filter and: "Nissan-216061XF0A-Overheating-CVT-Transmission-Oil-Cooler-O-RING" for the O-ring.
Thanks. I replace the cooler filter at each fluid change. I also replace the in pan "screen filter" rather than just cleaning it. They are both cheap, so I just change both each time I do a fluid change. The most expensive part of the change is always the CVT fluid itself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ignatz View Post
Might your tranny be low on fluid? Twice I had leaks, both fixed under warranty. There were no symptoms, i.e., no spots on the garage floor and no performance problems. It could be overheating because of less fluid to dissipate the heat.
I'm not sure. I haven't checked it yet. I will.

2014 Black Jeep Patriot, Latitude, FDII, Sun and Sound package, remote start
2015 White Jeep Grand Cherokee, Limited, Luxury group II

Last edited by DangerAaron; 04-09-2019 at 01:55 PM.
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post #9 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-09-2019, 01:22 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RossoRacer View Post
Hrm, I've heard of too much fluid causing it to whine and foam, but too little is an interesting thought. Changing that extra filter might help, as the higher revs from it being a FD2 probably aren't doing very much good. 50k should be just fine for a fluid/filter change interval, though 30k is of course a bit safer.

Some things that may interest you though:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B009PJJG1Q...riotconvert-20 Side note, this will stick out of the CVT fill tube about 6 inches too far when fully inserted and therefore should not be left in.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00Z7NXLPQ...riotconvert-20

https://www.amsoil.com/shop/by-produ...tic-cvt-fluid/

https://www.amazon.com/Valvoline-Con...smission+fluid

https://www.amazon.com/Jeep-Patriot-...gateway&sr=8-1
30K is way too often. I drive 86 miles each way to work. If I change the CVT fluid every 30K, I would be changing it every two months. I think 50K is more than reasonable and I haven't had any issues with my 50K changes until now. And I'm still only 7K from another change. I am not convinced that there is anything actually wrong with the fluid or the trans. Based on the fact that I got the light, but no whine and no degradation of performance it certainly doesn't fit the usual mode of "failure". I am more inclined to think that some other sensor or something flaked out and caused the light to trip, but other sensors were reading normally so the PCM didn't put the CVT into "safe mode". I didn't have my scanner with me when it happened. Once I got home everything looked normal. And, driving to work this morning under the exact same conditions it was uneventful and my scanner didn't pick up anything abnormal.
I have the dipstick. I won't use the pan with the drain plug because you can't inspect and clean the magnets or clean/change the screen filter without dropping the pan anyway. Changing the fluid without doing those things kind of seems like doing the job half-assed to me. Walmart sells Castrol transmax CVT fluid for 6 bucks a quart. And one of the 4 walmart's near me sells Amalie CVT fluid in a 12 quart case for 76 bucks. I'm sure Amsoil is the best of the best, but I'm not paying what they want.

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Last edited by DangerAaron; 04-09-2019 at 01:56 PM.
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post #10 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-09-2019, 03:38 PM
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Haha, can't blame you for not wanting to pay that much. I can understand wanting to make sure to clean the magnets every time too, especially given the reputation of the transmission, however using a drain plug to get 95% or more of the fluid out before dropping the pan could be a bit less messy. If nothing else, that at least can make it useful. Just bought Valvoline CVT fluid from my local parts store, they charged me 11 bucks a quart but the fluid has gotten a little pricier and they were doing something nice for me...plus they're local. As I understand the Valvoline is a decent second to Amsoil with Castrol being a close 3rd on this front, so that Walmart-Castrol deal is probably your best bet, as the price seems to make you understandably more comfortable with using their fluids.

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post #11 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-09-2019, 06:49 PM
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Hi DangerAaron

if you have a jeep patriot 2014, maybe you don have a CVT transsmision, anda maybe you have been used a wrong fluid.

check what transmision do you have.

I have understood that the jeep patriot since 2014 to 2017 have the 6 speed 6F24 transsmision.
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post #12 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-09-2019, 08:04 PM

 
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Originally Posted by Mr Gutt View Post
...I have understood that the jeep patriot since 2014 to 2017 have the 6 speed 6F24 transsmision.
Except for models with the 2.0l engine or the FDII package, which is what Aaron has.
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post #13 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-09-2019, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by DangerAaron View Post
30K is way too often. I drive 86 miles each way to work. If I change the CVT fluid every 30K, I would be changing it every two months. I think 50K is more than reasonable and I haven't had any issues with my 50K changes until now. And I'm still only 7K from another change. I am not convinced that there is anything actually wrong with the fluid or the trans. Based on the fact that I got the light, but no whine and no degradation of performance it certainly doesn't fit the usual mode of "failure". I am more inclined to think that some other sensor or something flaked out and caused the light to trip, but other sensors were reading normally so the PCM didn't put the CVT into "safe mode". I didn't have my scanner with me when it happened. Once I got home everything looked normal. And, driving to work this morning under the exact same conditions it was uneventful and my scanner didn't pick up anything abnormal.
I have the dipstick. I won't use the pan with the drain plug because you can't inspect and clean the magnets or clean/change the screen filter without dropping the pan anyway. Changing the fluid without doing those things kind of seems like doing the job half-assed to me. Walmart sells Castrol transmax CVT fluid for 6 bucks a quart. And one of the 4 walmart's near me sells Amalie CVT fluid in a 12 quart case for 76 bucks. I'm sure Amsoil is the best of the best, but I'm not paying what they want.
I think the towing is your issue especially since you did not lose performance. Sounds like the towing really degraded the fluid much quicker then when not towing. You may be correct that 50K between fluid changes is sufficient but add in the towing and that's the difference. You got decent mileage out of the cvt. You may want to treat it like an old hound that's been faithfully at your side and give it some extra treats in it's old age! Like some extra fluid changes and an upgraded trans cooler.
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Last edited by ralphfr; 04-09-2019 at 10:05 PM.
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post #14 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-10-2019, 12:55 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Sandstone View Post
Except for models with the 2.0l engine or the FDII package, which is what Aaron has.
Correct.... I have the FDii package which was only available with the CVT-II L transmission.
I may be the only person to say this, but if I had it to do over again, I would probably go with the FDi and the 6 speed auto. Other than the "low range" (which isn't that low in reality), the overly aggressive BLD programming, and hill decent control, anything else can be added to the FDi. Either through another package or aftermarket. While the HDC, the BLD programming, and the not so low, low range may come in handy occasionally, the CVT issues are not a worthwhile trade-off in my opinion.
I take my Patriot "off road" quite a bit. Usually in deep soft sand along the beach to get to my fishing spots. In 5 years, I have never used any of the FDii specific features other than the skid plates, and the tow hooks. And I could have added both of those to an FDi.
That being said, the CVT is the only real gripe I have with the vehicle. And, I can't complain too much. I'm nearing 200K with only preventive maintenance, replacing the right rear wheel hub, and now two trans overheat events. So, I would say my Patriot has been supremely reliable and given me excellent service. Only that if you remove the two trans overheat events, then 60% of my non-preventive maintenance items disappear as well. I will drive this thing until it literally falls apart around me.
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post #15 of 20 (permalink) Old 04-10-2019, 12:59 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ralphfr View Post
I think the towing is your issue especially since you did not lose performance. Sounds like the towing really degraded the fluid much quicker then when not towing. You may be correct that 50K between fluid changes is sufficient but add in the towing and that's the difference. You got decent mileage out of the cvt. You may want to treat it like an old hound that's been faithfully at your side and give it some extra treats in it's old age! Like some extra fluid changes and an upgraded trans cooler.
I have now driven it back and forth on my long commute for two days with a scanner hooked up and monitoring it along the way. Nothing abnormal either day. I will do a fluid/filter change this weekend, and consider it done unless something else happens before Friday. I already have two old Blue Tick hounds that love to ride in the backseat. The Patriot is just part of the "pack" at this point.

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