The EPA website has rating for the Patriot using the old test vs. the new test for fuel economy. They only have the 4wd.

Manual (http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/calculatorCompareSideBySide.jsp?column=1&id=23810)

Auto (http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/calculatorCompareSideBySide.jsp?column=1&id=23809)

Thanks for that - and what a difference on the automatic model!

Still can't wait to see numbers for a Diesel Patriot! :D

I'm getting 23 City with the Auto... and I only have 400 miles on it. Driving style has a significant impact on MPG. I'm the kind of driver that looks far ahead and anticipates starts and stops. And I always get AT LEAST AS GOOD as the "inflated" MPG ratings. I fully expect to get 27+ on the highway.

update: I just checked the "new" MPG for my old vehicle ('05 Scion xB)... they say 27/31, I was consistently getting 32/36.

My wife is a "press the accelerator until I have to press the brake" type of driver and she always complains of poor MPG numbers.

Good Post... Thanks!!!
That 4WD MPG is what I'm Getting now in my Vue.....
another point to the Patriot "pro" side.

well, I have gone through 4 tanks of gas and I still haven't gotten better than 20 MPG. And, I am not an acceleration nut or a real speed type of guy.

How is everyone else doing?

I looked at the new epa ratings for the turbocharged Subaru Legacy GT my wife got in june and the numbers we get are way better than what they posted. And we drive in pretty fast and in alot of traffic.

well, I have gone through 4 tanks of gas and I still haven't gotten better than 20 MPG. And, I am not an acceleration nut or a real speed type of guy.

How is everyone else doing?

I have filled up about a dozen times and am getting around 25-26. I have over 2k miles on it though!

you guys should post what kind of patriot you have. I'm sure a 2WD 5 speed gets much better mpg than a 4WD CVTII Patriot...

Does anyone know the MPG on a trailrated limited?
Also, When I ordered my Trailrated Limited I noticed on the form it said 6.2 additional gallons of gas. Does this mean I'm getting a bigger tank?

When I ordered mine they explained that each Patriot came with 6.2 gallons of gas in the tank. If you are not careful they will also charge you $16 extra for it.

wow a whole extra $16, be careful...... are you kidding

When I ordered mine they explained that each Patriot came with 6.2 gallons of gas in the tank. If you are not careful they will also charge you $16 extra for it.

Ive never heard of a car that didnt come with a complementary full tank of gas. My best friend just got a Dodge Ram 2500 and they filled it up for him. And every car Ive ever bought came with a full tank free of charge. I think there may have been a misunderstanding there.

Our Patriot 4 X 4, Limited, CVTII, Automatic: 1350 miles driven, mixed country/city/hwy, some ice & snow and generally cold temps. 22.3 MPG. The new EPA estimates are 22 MPG for the Patriot.

It's interesting to note the revised estimates for some of the Patriot's competitors:

Suzuki Grand Vitara = 19
Honda CR-V = 22
Honda Element = 21
Rav4 (4 cylinder) = 22
Rav4 (6 cylinder) = 21
Ford Escape (4 cylinder) = 20
Ford Escape (6 cylinder) = 19.

you guys should post what kind of patriot you have. I'm sure a 2WD 5 speed gets much better mpg than a 4WD CVTII Patriot...

Hey good thinking!

I have an auto 4WD sport. I did some skiing this week so I had some highway miles so I got a little better...23mpg. Still, not very great as the Patriot only has a 13.5 gallon tank. At the 17-18 MPG I have been averaging I am getting around 235. not good....

Why the press says that CVT offer better MPG numbers when the difference between manual and CVT are 2MPG against CVT (at least with EPA measurement)
Or the statement is only valid between traditional auto and CVT?

Why the press says that CVT offer better MPG numbers when the difference between manual and CVT are 2MPG against CVT (at least with EPA measurement)
Or the statement is only valid between traditional auto and CVT?

they are talking about the CVT getting better gas mileage than a traditional automatic

The 6.2 Gallons of gas listed on the invoice is how much the factory puts in it to get it off and on of transports, etc. The tank is the same size as the other Patriots. Yes, 2wd vs. 4wd, and auto vs. manual will make some difference in fuel economy too. With most of those it is a weight issue, and then some gearing ratios (I think-With CVT I'm not sure though). Plus, most vehicles do not hit the optimum fuel milage until they have a few thousand miles on them to properly break them in. Engines these days don't have to be driven more conservatively to break them in, but they do need some time to perform the best.

This is my $.02 on the subject! I used to sell cars (ha ha, snicker snicker) at a Ford/Dodge/Chrysler/Jeep dealership, so I know (or remember) some of the ins and outs.

Does anyone know the weight of a trail rated limited vs. a regular 4X4 limited? I know that can effect mpg.

http://www.ifilm.com/video/2832528

This isn't Jeep related. But I thought it was pretty funny.

The weight different is probably minimal since the Trail rated version is nearly identical to the FD1 system. Save for the ride height, some electronic programing and a couple tow hooks... There are no skid plates offered (that I know of)

The biggest difference between FD1 and FD2 is the pulley ratios inside the CVT and this is what effects the MPG rating on the FD2 models so much {they have a higher final drive ratio.}


My sisters 4x2 Compass just did 130 miles on a 1/4 tank of gas. After we filled it up again I ran the numbers and it worked out to roughly 30MPG on the highway.

about how many MPGs would the trail rated get?

The weight different is probably minimal since the Trail rated version is nearly identical to the FD1 system. Save for the ride height, some electronic programing and a couple tow hooks... There are no skid plates offered (that I know of)

The biggest difference between FD1 and FD2 is the pulley ratios inside the CVT and this is what effects the MPG rating on the FD2 models so much {they have a higher final drive ratio.}





There are skid plates offered. It has an engine & transmission and fuel tank steel skid plates that are 3.2 mm thick. Additionally, it has an extra oil cooler, the radiator is heavy duty w/ a higher wattage fan, it has a bigger alternator, it has venting for the rear differential, additional structural reinforcement of the rear suspension, and it has a differant ABS unit. So I think there is a signifigant wieght differance. Of course the drive ratio would make a differance in a traditional transmission but theoretically, it should make less of a differance in a CVT because the transmission is variable. Because it can vary its ratios to essentially anything in a certain range whereas a traditional tranny is locked at certain ratios, I would think the main place you would notice a differance if the wieghts were the same would be at high speeds where you are approaching the ratio limits of the transmission. Its hard to say what the FDII's will get as far as MPG beacuase they havent hit the dealerships yet and even then, they will get better MPG after they are broken in.

Yup, you are right. :oops: I am a little bit suprised about all of the structural reinforcment parts needed...

So what kind of weight is that? 500 extra pounds? It can't be too much more right? The last time I looked at the MPG numbers on the website it was 28MPG for the FD1 and 24MPG for the FD2 but we all know how accurate an EPA estimate really is.

Ive been trying to figure it out, I havent seen any FDII specific numbers. I would guess that its at least 300lbs.

Indeed there are some skid plates on the FDII, for the fuel tank. Snagged (read stole) these pics somewhere online, and would credit them, but don't remember where I got them.

I've had mine for almost 3 weeks, got 23.6 mpg on first tank, 23.4 on second tank, and am at about 24.9 on third tank, which is almost gone. Sport, FDI, 5 spd manual. My commute is about 20 miles, not during rush hour (which is key-I don't endure stop and go traffic), and about half surface streets w/ stop lights/signs, then half on highway (slowly accelerate and set cruise asap).

I can amuse myself (very mildly) by watching the average mpg on the EVIC. It will slowly tick downward by tenths of mpg while on the surface streets, and then slowly tick upward by tenths when the cruise is set on the highway.

Yeah I milk the mileage--I can kick in the clutch and coast almost 3/4 mile into my driveway if I crest a nearby hill at about 33-35 mph. I also do a lot of coasting toward exit ramps, stops, anywhere that I don't need to maintain a speed or accelerate. It just requires anticipation....

Well if you get the FD II package and want to get rid of some extra weight, I know some girl would be very happy to take the skid plates off of your hands :-D

not me, I'll definatly need em!!!!

I just got my Trail Rated FD2...got 22.2 mpg on first tank full. I drive easy and not a lot of stop and go...So far the mpg is treating me pretty well, I originally ordered a FD1 because of the gas mileage and the fact that I'm much more of a commuter than off-roader...But they got one in and I couldn't wait. I love the fact that it comes with additional cooling, seals, and relocated vents. I'm hoping that this will yield some more durablilty in the long run....

Greetings!

When I got my new Patriot Sport (FWD, CVT) I got a voucher from the dealership for a full tank of gas, so I topped it off (13.5 gal tank) and set the Trip A odometer. This weekend I drove it until I got the low gas warning light. The manual says that goes off with two gallons left, so I figured 11.5 gallons @ 264 miles and came up with 22.9 miles per gallon as my first real world gas mileage. Not too bad for mostly city driving.

I HOPE they charge me $16.00 for the 6.2 gallons of gas. Regular low-test cheapo gas here in San Diego is $3.35 per gallon, so I'll save enough money buying gas from Chrysler to get 2 fish tacos for lunch!

I have a 2wd automatic Sport. Now, granted... I'm still on the first tank and have only put 150 miles on the car but I'm at 24mph city. Not too shabby (heck of a lot better than the 19mpg my Ranger got). I have the mpg indicator in the instrument cluster so it's actually quite fun to drive around and try to get that mpg to crawl upward.

I have a 2wd automatic Sport. Now, granted... I'm still on the first tank and have only put 150 miles on the car but I'm at 24mph city. Not too shabby (heck of a lot better than the 19mpg my Ranger got). I have the mpg indicator in the instrument cluster so it's actually quite fun to drive around and try to get that mpg to crawl upward.

thats pretty good especially considering it will prob go up as you put more miles on your car

Limited 4x2 5-speed and a heavy foot. I have 1150 miles on my Patriot and I started keeping track on my second fill-up.

As of todays fill-up I've used 32.3 gallons to go 829 miles giving me about 25.6mpg. And I'd say that 2/3rds of those miles are highway. Not too bad - hopefully it will improve.

I usually do around 80mph on the highways.
What would be the optimum highway speed for best mileage?

What would be the optimum highway speed for best mileage?

the lowest rpms you can get in 5th gear.

well, I have gone through 4 tanks of gas and I still haven't gotten better than 20 MPG. And, I am not an acceleration nut or a real speed type of guy.

How is everyone else doing?

Well,do you live in a hilly country?Do you drive in lots of traffic.
I must say that with my Ford Focus I never got the factory fuel rating and I would say that the Focus drinks between 10 - 15 % more.

I am getting 21-23 city and 26-27 Highway. 1300 miles.
I drive in Atlanta Traffic (75 and 285) and to the N. GA. Mountains.
It is doing pretty well for a 4x4/AWD.:smiley_thumbs_up:

Well,do you live in a hilly country?Do you drive in lots of traffic.
I must say that with my Ford Focus I never got the factory fuel rating and I would say that the Focus drinks between 10 - 15 % more.




We also have a Ford Focus and it takes in more gas than the factory fuel rating also. We have just over 100K miles on it and its about to fall apart lol. Most of the problems we had with it where door handles breaking trunk latch, and then the ball joint on the right was totally shot. We have had it fixed multiple times and it never really is able to be fixed. We are so sick of the Focus, Im looking forward to sinking into some patriot seats sometime soon.

What I have found is that if the car has a manual I can meet or even exceed the highway rating. If the car has an automatic the best I can do is get close to the highway mpg. My Patriot is too new but currently getting 25 mpg.

What is truly impressive is that a Focus made it to 100k. I've got one and it just does not inspire confidence.

We also have a Ford Focus and it takes in more gas than the factory fuel rating also. We have just over 100K miles on it and its about to fall apart lol. Most of the problems we had with it where door handles breaking trunk latch, and then the ball joint on the right was totally shot. We have had it fixed multiple times and it never really is able to be fixed. We are so sick of the Focus, Im looking forward to sinking into some patriot seats sometime soon.

In a way I feel the same about my focus.It seems so fragile.I get this grinding noise from the front righ side and when I take it to Ford they don't hear anything,the technicians go completely deaf when I tell them of the problem.I had it checked by an indepedent mechanic and he isn't sure either what it is.Well,I got 110 K out of it and traded it for 3 700,not much but I don't have the tiime and energy to run around and sell it privately.

I just put 480 miles on the Pat this weekend, going from Tucson to Sedona and back. Air conditioning was on 70% of the time, with some hilly climbs and cruising around 75-80mph. Got 26.5mpg. 2wd automatic.

I'm looking forward to buying a CVT2L/Trail Rated Patriot Sport (North, in Canada) sometime this summer. BUT...

Having gone from Jeeps with 4.0L engines (poor MPGs, great torque) to a 2004 Focus with 2.0L Zetec (great MPGs, no problems, but not sure of reliability after initial 3 years), I don't know that I want to get low MPGs again...

Can't quite understand that, even with a few hundred pounds more, the CVT2L would get such LOWER mileage than the regular CVT/non-Trail Rated model... Maybe the increased height is the reason??? I would have expected closer to the regular one. Tough decision to make... Will appreciate any info here on real world MPG from Trail Rated versions, as some of you get them.

Thanks already!

I'm looking forward to buying a CVT2L/Trail Rated Patriot Sport (North, in Canada) sometime this summer. BUT...

Having gone from Jeeps with 4.0L engines (poor MPGs, great torque) to a 2004 Focus with 2.0L Zetec (great MPGs, no problems, but not sure of reliability after initial 3 years), I don't know that I want to get low MPGs again...

Can't quite understand that, even with a few hundred pounds more, the CVT2L would get such LOWER mileage than the regular CVT/non-Trail Rated model... Maybe the increased height is the reason??? I would have expected closer to the regular one. Tough decision to make... Will appreciate any info here on real world MPG from Trail Rated versions, as some of you get them.

Thanks already!
The difference in MPG between the FDI and FDII is due to the gearing differences between the two. At highway speeds, the FDI will run the engine at significantly lower rpms... that will result in better gas mileage.

My advice... unless you plan on regular off-road outings where you definitely need the FDII, get the FDI and spring $10 for a "Trail Rated" badge. ;)

"The difference in MPG between the FDI and FDII is due to the gearing differences between the two. At highway speeds, the FDI will run the engine at significantly lower rpms... that will result in better gas mileage."


I agree with this statement. I have a FDII/CVT2, and when driving at 75 mph, the RPM's are up to 3200. When driving 80 mph, the RPM's are up to 3600. Not sure what RPM's other patriot owners are getting with their FDI or manual engines. I am sure they are getting lower RPM's, which ultimately lead to better gas mileage.

That being said, I was able to do some light off roading (mostly trails, occasional hills, and deep sand) w/o the "low," gear, and the patriot did fine. I was really impressed. If you plan on doing some light to moderate duty off-roading, and if gas mileage is a premium, skip the FDII & go with the FDI w manual.

Curb Weight, lb. —Est
Sport 2WD 3108;
Sport 4WD 3251;
Limited 2WD 3168;
Limited 4WD 3326
Weight Distribution, percent F/R_________ 57/43 2WD, 56/44 4WD

I saw th $16 for 6.2 gal on the dealer's invoice when we were negotiating the price. What the heck, that's $2.58 p/gal., at the pumps now in NJ it's close to $3!

I have gone through precisely one tank of gas so far, and it got 24-25 mpg. Highway driving is about 80% of the total miles.

If it maintains that mileage I am going to be smiling like the cheshire cat. My 98 Cherokee got 17, maybe 18 downhill with a tailwind.

I usually drive between 70 and 75 on the highway, depending on conditions, though I find the ride in this vehicle so relaxing I actually find myself driving a little slower now, between 65 and 70.

BP

I'm on my third tank.... so far I'm getting around 25mpg (city only - no highway) This is on the Limited 4x4 - standard trans. I ain't complainin'

:D

I have had my 4x4 sport since FEB and I had been getting around 16-18 MPG. I have been reading in "wunder" at everyones great mileage. So, needless to say I have been watching my trip like a hawk....and over the last 5 full tanks I have improved to over 20 with the last one clocking in at 26.6 MPG--now most of those are "good miles" on a 10 mile strip of highway (of 15 mile trip one way) on the way to work. But still, I feel great about it!!!

I don't know if this is a repost or not, but here is a link for calculating your mileage.

http://duende.dhs.org/mileage/

I picked up mine (Limited FDII with off-road group) and got 26 mpg on the first tank and had up to 30.4 mpg on the second tank during portions of a trip.

holy cow^^

I should cross the 5000 mile mark on my way to work tomorrow. As of my last fill-up my overall mpg for 4600 miles was at 25.2mpg. Not too bad - was hopping for maybe a few more miles per gal - even dropped my speeding habit down by 5 - 10 mph.

holy cow^^
You can't rely on the EVIC reporting of MPG. If you coast for a stretch, MPG rises... hard accelerate and it immediately drops. You have to calculate it by hand over the course of a tankful.

Interesting, but it's a surprise, a Ford Escape 2.3 L automatic at 20 combine and the Patriot 24 combine

yea my EVIC over my 1000 mile weekend trip from maryland to ohio and back netted me maximum average mpg of 25mpg and i have a FD1 5 speed 4x4. granted i had a fair amount of gear and passenger and i was traversing some of the appalachians but i expected more even from the EVIC calculations.

Just got back from an over 400km trip and the EVIC was indicating 8.0 l/100km. That works out to about 29.3 MPG. The vehicle had less than 900 km or about 550 miles on it when we started the trip.

We had 2 bikes on the back and the cargo and rear seat area was filled almost to the roof with tents and gear.

I am pretty happy with the mileage it is getting.

addFinally got on some clear roads. Getting better than 28 mpg.

4x4 Limited with 5spd, 1100 miles

maybe its my driving habits, i was going around 80mph average the entire trip so that might have decreased the mpg a bit.

maybe its my driving habits, i was going around 80mph average the entire trip so that might have decreased the mpg a bit.

I am finding that the Patriot is very sensitive to driving habits with regards to gas mileage. In my Wrangler or XJ Cherokee it didn't matter how I drove. The only difference in mileage would be about 1 mpg. If you try to get good gas mileage you will in a Patriot. I've gotten as low as 23 and as high as my current tankfull that will end up as either 28 or 29 mpg.

I am finding that the Patriot is very sensitive to driving habits with regards to gas mileage. In my Wrangler or XJ Cherokee it didn't matter how I drove. The only difference in mileage would be about 1 mpg. If you try to get good gas mileage you will in a Patriot. I've gotten as low as 23 and as high as my current tankfull that will end up as either 28 or 29 mpg.
That is pretty impressive! so do you think i should expect better than 30 since mine is a 2WD????

That is pretty impressive! so do you think i should expect better than 30 since mine is a 2WD???? YES. After break in you should be able to beat 30 on a highway at reasonable speeds. Not much better but I suspect you will have a few trips of 31 / 32 mpg where the travel is 85%+ interstate or local highway. What is good news is that you will get within that 26 - 30 mpg window. Just think you are doing 50% - 75% better than an XJ Cherokee for the same size vehicle.

YES. After break in you should be able to beat 30 on a highway at reasonable speeds. Not much better but I suspect you will have a few trips of 31 / 32 mpg where the travel is 85%+ interstate or local highway. What is good news is that you will get within that 26 - 30 mpg window. Just think you are doing 50% - 75% better than an XJ Cherokee for the same size vehicle.

yay that is going to be great!! I am excited! :pepper:

I'm a bit disappointed in my Pat's highway mileage. On two different trips (same route, though) I only am getting 25-26mpg on the highway. Granted I AM carrying a bike on my roof rack, but that shouldn't cut it down THAT far.

I'm in a 2wd automatic cruising at 75mph. Now it is still a world of difference better than my old Ford Ranger but still... I thought I'd be getting at least 28 on the highway. Maybe it is a combination of the bike rack, air conditioning and a decent amount of climbing. But still... kinda :( about it.

I'm a bit disappointed in my Pat's highway mileage. On two different trips (same route, though) I only am getting 25-26mpg on the highway. Granted I AM carrying a bike on my roof rack, but that shouldn't cut it down THAT far.

I'm in a 2wd automatic cruising at 75mph. Now it is still a world of difference better than my old Ford Ranger but still... I thought I'd be getting at least 28 on the highway. Maybe it is a combination of the bike rack, air conditioning and a decent amount of climbing. But still... kinda :( about it.

I think you answered your concerns. Also, if you are climbing, you are at altitude and that will effect air density/pressure also - but I think that is what the engine computers are for - calculating and optimizing that. If you are flat with moderate terrain, not climbing, aerodynamic, not using the air and not going 75mph, perhaps you would get better gas mileage.

At the speeds you are going, that bike and rack have a huge amount of drag. I am not rocket scientist, but I would think these all come to play with your gas mileage.

AZCycle, that is pretty good mileage for what you are doing. I'll bet you that you're getting 28 MPG under normal conditions.

Just a follow up. Trip of 250 miles 85% state highways. Cruise control set between 5 - 10 mph over limit whenever possible. a/c on half the time includes one day in Atlanta rush hour traffic (25.5 mpg). EVIC recorded 28.3 / Calculated manually 27.5. Either method rounds to 28 (mpg). I am actually getting 29.5 in the current tankful when I turned off the a/c.

That is excellent mileage out of an SUV and incredible out of a 4x4 the size of the Patriot. I'm finding that the Patriot is very sensitive to how you drive it and if you run it through the lower 3 gears quickly and get to 4th and 5th at 2000 rpm you will maximize mpg and still have good performance.

We're averaging almost 23 MPG, 22.98 exactly according to Automotive Wolf (http://www.lonewolf-software.com/automotivewolf.htm)

Here's a screen shot.

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f139/festerw/mileage.jpg

Try doing 75 in an XJ with all your equipment and climbing. You'll be real happy with your Pat's mileage.

Yah, I know I'm being very whiny, and I AM happy with the mileage overall. Just expecting too much. :D

I am getting no where near what I expected...
I have been driving moderately nothing crazy not too much petal to the metal or anything and I am getting less then 22 mpg! this is 90% highway driving and I have 4x4 CVTII I have a little over 500 miles and ahh its frustrating!!

oh...and ZERO a/c

crgaskamp, Mine went up 2 mpg average somewhere around 750 miles on the odometer.

but still...24 mpg highway with an FDI...thats not what im expecting

but still...24 mpg highway with an FDI...thats not what im expecting Didn't say that was where you would end up! I just noticed my mileage went from 23.5 to 25.5 at around 750 miles then jumped again to some very respectable numbers in the upper 20s as I passed 1000 miles and also learned what the Patriot likes. I cannot say how to coax maximum MPG out of the CVT but can on the 5 spd. I will get maximum average mileage by running through gears 1-3 quickly and shifting at between 3500 - 4000 RPM and then keeping RPMs low in 4th or 5th shifting out of 4th at 2500 RPM and staying in the upper gears down to about 1500 RPM. Below 1500 RPM the engine is uncomfortable and will not accelerate.

Now maximum MPG on my Wrangler involved keeping RPMs low all the time. The shift points were much lower but you could get down to 1000 RPM and still not lug it. Of course maximum MPG was around 19.5 MPG downhill and with a tailwind and worst MPG was 16.5 MPG in traffic hell.

Drove from KS city to STL over the weeked, have 7k on the odometer and got close to 30. Im a happy camper. I started out around 25 mpg in the begining with my 4x2 sport.

Mine is odd.

I can run the same stretch of road to and from work and get 25 MPG one tank and 20 another. The tank I am on is presently about 21.

I know the Patriot does not tolerate headwinds mileage wise. If I am running into the wind, mileage suffers a lot.

FDII Limited.

We have had our patriot for a little over a month. It has around 2800 km on it. It is a Patriot 4x4 2.4l 5spd.

We have kept track of the EVIC economy and the actual economy.

odometer EVIC Actual
447 8.4 l/100km 8.7 l/100km
889 8.6 8.8
1431 8.2 7.9 (lot of hwy)
1886 8.6 8.2 (lot of hwy with A/C)
2356 8.4 8.5 (lot of hwy)
2841 8.5 8.4 (lot of city)
Average 8.4 = 28 mpg (US)

EnerGuide Rating is
City 9.3 l/100km = 25 mpg (US)
Highway 7.4 l/100km = 32 mpg (US)

It has averaged 8.4 l/100km or 34 mpg (CAN) or 28 mpg (US)
The EVIC has been pretty accurate, unlike the Liberty I used to own. It always read about +8% on the optimistic side.

I would say the Patriot is not quite achieving the EnerGuide rating but it is close.

I got 22mpg on my first tank and got 26 on second tank of gas. Thats alot better than my dakota was getting, it was getting about 16mpg

Edit: My best mileage has now been 28.5 mpg. I think the slight boost has come from using synthetic (Mobil 1) at my first oil change at 3500k. However, and I did edit my previous post, the mileage has slowly been creeping up before the Mobil 1.

My lowest mileage has been 25.5 with 30% city and 70% highway, AC on 95% of the time (Florida). My best has been 27.6 under the same conditions except I have dropped my highway speed a tad. I am ready for my first oil change at 3000 miles. I think I will use a synthetic blend and decide later if I want to go total synthetic. Maybe the synthetic will increase my mileage.

DJP

FWD Sport, CVT 2.4 litre

I never beleive those MPG ratings....my Dodge RAM 2500 with the 5.7L Hemi is suppose to get....get this...are you ready?.....................18mpg.....The only way I would see that is traveling downhill with a tailwind......They got that rating because the test is done on completely flat road and never exceeded 55mph.....

So my point is those rating never seem to come from real world driving...although I hear they are improving the tests to be a little more acurate.

All that said I am curious to see what the Pat gets for MPG.....picking it up tomorrow night...:D

Actually the test is performed indoors on a machine that looks like a dyno metere and it mimics the stress of standard driving. They have a professional sit inside the vehicle and watch a screen that tells them exactly how fast to go and for how long.

Its kind of a crazy looking process and looks as if there would be plenty of room to improve upon... and I guess they thought so too since they are changing the process for all models produced after 2007.

Can anyone with a trail rated Pat give me an idea of how many miles per TANK they've been getting?

I filled up at around a half tank and had alittle over 150 miles. I think I averaged about 21mpg on that tank.

"Can anyone with a trail rated Pat give me an idea of how many miles per TANK they've been getting?"

I have a FDII, CVT2L. I drive in a hilly & windy area. I am light on the gas pedal. I have been getting 19-21 miles in the city, and 21-24 miles on the highway. On flat roads, no wind, I got 26 mpg. As always, YMMV.

I got about 23 mpg on my first tank, 25 on the second and I hope a little better on the third tank- 4x4 limited, not trail rated, CVT, A/C on all the time, mix of highway/city. The EVIC seems consistantly lower than actual mileage.

And the 4x4 Patriot has a 13.5 gallon (U.S. measure) tank so 285 miles per tankful is a safe estimate. 305 is safe for a non-trail rated.

That's about what I figured it out to be. Thanks for the info guys. Can you all check my "Rolling Back" thread and let me know what you think?

Mine goes to 305-315 before the low fuel chime sounds and the light comes on. One thing I dislike is the funnel factor gas gauge. I can drive 100 miles on the first quarter tank, nearly 200 miles just over a half tank and use the remainder to reach 300+ like it has a Hemi (in gas mileage only) under the hood making a precipitous plunge to empty!

DJP

not bad for a 4wd

I got about 23 mpg on my first tank, 25 on the second and I hope a little better on the third tank- 4x4 limited, not trail rated, CVT, A/C on all the time, mix of highway/city. The EVIC seems consistantly lower than actual mileage.
You probably already do this, but make sure to reset the EVIC mileage calculator after each fill-up. It took me nearly 2000 miles to figure out that I could do that. LOL So before reseting it, what the EVIC was reporting was total mpg average since I owned the vehicle.

We have just over 5400 KM on the Patriot and have averaged 8.37 L/100km. That is to 33.7 MP Imperial G and around 28 MP US G. Most of this is HWY miles. The worst tank was 8.8 L/100KM and the best tank was 7.8 L/100KM.

I have kept track of the fuel economy on the EVIC as well as calculating it from the Odometer and actual gas used. The EVIC is very accurate. It is usually dead on since the first few tanks, and in the worst case it is off by 0.2 L/100KM. When it is off indicates worse economy than actual.

I have checked the speedometer with a GPS and it looks like it is right on. It is hard to judge the accuracy of the speedometer since it has markings every 10KPH.

I am very happy with the fuel economy.

I am getting nowhere near that,

The best we've had is 9.7/100kM

With a 4x2 manual sport, we are getting 22 mpg city, 30 highway, averaging 25 (computer is slightly lower than actual), 20 when fully loaded and roof cargo box on.

25.4 mpg from Columbus to Akron and back...and a little bit of city driving in between. 310 miles and 12.2 gallons and kept it at about 70-73 mph on the freeway.

Get this: I'm getting BETTER mileage in town than I am on the highway. I've been steadily getting 25.6 in town (with A/C) and this weekend on a 3-hour roundtrip highway journey (with A/C doing 75mph steady) got 23mpg!

Weird. I only got close to 30mpg at the very beginning, when the Pat's computer was limiting for the break-in period. Since then, I haven't broken 26 on the highway. And this is with little or no climbing, steady cruising (but usually always with the A/C on).

azcycle, I'm in Tucson too, took a trip to San Diego this weekend and like you, get worse mileage on the higway then city. Maybe because it's 110 outside and we're running the AC on high the whole time??? I am very disappointed with the mileage though.

We're getting WAY better mileage in town.
It seems, the pat struggles on the highway.

I'm getting better on the interstate, but on my 1600 mile road trip over the 4th, I still just got barely 25 hiway, no air, and no faster the 72 mph.

Are owners of the 5 spd model experiencing disappointing gas mileage as well or is it mainly with the CVT?

My factory sticker says 26/23 (my model has CVT & 4x4 FD1).

My last tank gave me 25.6MPG and half of the tank was used on a trip with 6 people in the car (over 1000lbs of passengers), so I am happy with the CVT mileage.

However, I did keep the speed under 70mph. I was using cruise control at around 68mph.

My first couple tanks were not as great, but it could have been the break-in period.

Just got my Pat last week, and over the first 500 miles with mixed city/ highway I'm getting 24.5. It climbs steadily when driving on the highway, but I haven't really been breaking 65 because I don't want to overdo it over the first 1000 miles.

Still, I'm happy with it so far. Once you crack 70mph MPG is going to suffer in any vehicle you drive, so that's not too much of a surprise.

EDIT: My bad! :) Limited 4X4 CVT FDI

Come on people. If you are going to post your mileage experiences at least state what transmission you have. CVT, 5Spd, 4x4, 4x2, FDI or FDII. Or better yet, add that info in your sig so that it is readily available as a reference.

Does anyone know why I'm getting better MPG on the first half of my tank than the last?

Black Patriot Limited FDII

Yes... Its because the Fuel gauge is Non-Linear. There is almost a 2:1 ratio between the first half and second half of the gauge.

I don't know why they designed it that way. Its fine once you get used to it.

Maybe they wanted the perception that "Wow, I just went 200 miles on half a tank".

Seems to me that all gas gages are like that anymore. My car is the same way!!

I think the Men From Mopar take out the 2.4 and dump in a Hemi when you are just over half a tank.

I think the Men From Mopar take out the 2.4 and dump in a Hemi when you are just over half a tank.

You wish! Actually it has to do mostly with the way the tanks are designed. they are not perfectly square boxes but the device that picks up the fuel level is just a float hooked to an electronic sensor. (at least that's what I remember from the 90's vehicles I drove so I assume it hasn't changed) This means its pretty linear if the electronic circuit was designed right it should be linear.

So overall I love my Riot, however as mentioned before, I am getting less than stellar gas mileage. Just did another check and I'm down to 20 MPG, in city. I imagine hwy will be less since it was before too.

I was getting about 22 in city, its down to 19.8 exactly. HWY was at 17-19, yes I have a lead foot on the HWY, not in town though.

Any sugguestions?

Azrayne,

I am a little puzzled at how you could get 17-19 mpg on the highway with your Patriot? I can do better than that with my V8 Durango! I routinely get 27 + mpg with my Patriot. I am easy on the gas, but you should at least be getting 20-24 unless you are re-creating the car chase scenes from episodes of Manix or something :D. Or maybe the Men From Mopar did put a Hemi in your Jeep! Make a concerted effort to drive extra easy for one or two tanks of gas and compare. If you are still getting sub-par mileage, then take it in and get the latest software installed that everyone is talking about. Otherwise, I would think the CVT is not working correctly.

DJP

So overall I love my Riot, however as mentioned before, I am getting less than stellar gas mileage. Just did another check and I'm down to 20 MPG, in city. I imagine hwy will be less since it was before too.


Your location might be a clue as to your mileage problems. I haven't seen it mentioned here but it is a fact that higher temperatures = lower mpg. Gasoline, like any liquid, expands when heated and thus contains less energy for a given volume. It is likely we will soon see a regulation requiring gas pumps to factor the fuel temperature into the pricing structure because you are effectively getting less gas the warmer it gets.

I live in Florida and typically buy my gas in the morning on my way to work when the traffic is much lighter. Never thought I may be getting more gas. I really wonder though what impact the heat has on mileage or your gasoline volume. I suspect it would be a very small percentage.

I think the difference between morning and afternoon would be insignificant. It is the temperature of the gas in the underground tanks we are concerned with and it builds slowly as we transition from winter into summer. I know it is under investigation by a regulatory agency but do not recall which one. Insofar as this thread is concerned I am of the opinion that the fuel in your gas tank would be effected in the same manner and you should get less mpg in hot weather.

I am the first to admit the poor gas mileage on the hwy. I was driving with a lead foot. Let's just leave it that if you drive faster than 80-85...considerably, you will get worse mileage. I accept that. in the city though, I drive very different.

And yes, its Africa hot here. Up above 105 daily. AC on high all the time, lots of running into stores and out, I'm a sales person. And my hwy drive had me going through 117 heat for about 150 miles. 300 miles were above 105 degrees.

It's getting close to its 1st oil change time and I will mention this to them.

I am the first to admit the poor gas mileage on the hwy. I was driving with a lead foot. Let's just leave it that if you drive faster than 80-85...considerably, you will get worse mileage. I accept that. in the city though, I drive very different.

And yes, its Africa hot here. Up above 105 daily. AC on high all the time, lots of running into stores and out, I'm a sales person. And my hwy drive had me going through 117 heat for about 150 miles. 300 miles were above 105 degrees.

It's getting close to its 1st oil change time and I will mention this to them.

Yep, same here... though I don't take mine above 80mph on the highway. My less than expected highway miles are usually attributed to a bicycle strapped to the top of my Pat.

And I thought *I* was the only Inferno Red 4x2 in Tucson! :boxing:

sorry to "rayne" on your parade....:wow:. What side of town do you own cause I think we're the only 2 in town.

Your location might be a clue as to your mileage problems. I haven't seen it mentioned here but it is a fact that higher temperatures = lower mpg. Gasoline, like any liquid, expands when heated and thus contains less energy for a given volume. It is likely we will soon see a regulation requiring gas pumps to factor the fuel temperature into the pricing structure because you are effectively getting less gas the warmer it gets.

I understand what you are saying about the expansion of gasoline with temperature. In fact, designers have accounted for this for years with expansion relief features in fuel tanks (I know even my 1971 Dart has this.) Ever leave your lawnmower can in a hot garage? They puff up like they are going to pop!

I disagree that the density of the fuel you purchase from gasoline stations changes significantly on hot days.

All gasoline stations have underground storage tanks. Below four feet, temperatures stay 50-55 degrees F year-round; therefore, the fuel is approximately that temperature. This doesn't change much the entire year - summer or winter... ask a spelunker!

Even when the ambient temperature is in the 90's, when I pump fuel, the metal parts of the handle get very cold. Take notice next time that you fill up.

Of course, fuel temperature will go up (in the summertime) the longer it is in a tanker truck. But, suppliers don't make money by distributing fuel to distant gas stations. Most suppliers are local to stations they serve. Even four hours won't raise the temperature of the fuel significantly.

The cost of the re-fitting temperature compensating equipment won't provide a signifcant savings, but you can be assured that it's cost and installation will be passed on to us as consumers.

Just sayin'... :)

I think it depends a lot on the type of driving one does,I think on the highway you may get better fuel economy with the automatic ,the manual in 5th gear runs at about 3 000 - 60 - 70 mph]and that's little bit too high in my opinion,too bad the manual doesn't come with 6th gear

The powerband is higher on a 4 so you will see higher rpms compared to a 6 or an 8.

I think the biggest mpg problem is the CVT.... Let me rephrase that. The biggest problem is that drivers haven't figured out the differences in CVT and haven't yet adjusted their driving style.

Knowing what I know about the engineering concept behind the CVT technology, stomping on the gas peddle and waiting for the CVT to catch up is probably the last thing you want to do. You want the engine rpms just ahead of the CVT so it can smoothly decrease the gear ratio to cruising speed. This should have two effects. First it should dramatically increase your mpg and secondly, you would probably wind up accelerating faster.

To explain I think what might be happening is that the CVT might actually be increasing the gear ratio at the initial surge. I know it's electronically controlled and it probably has failsafe limits. So, when it senses the severe increase in rpms, it kicks down to avoid potential damage and then adjusts back up from there.

Now I have only driven it once on the initial testdrive of the Patriot, but that's certainly what it felt like to me and by the end I wasn't over-revving the engine and actually getting better acceleration than the salesman did. The salesman who rode along even asked me if I had driven the CVTs before because I seemed to know what I was doing. I can't say if he was just kissing butt for the sale or if he was sincere.

I opted for the 5 speed myself since I have such a long history with a stick and don't even think about it when I drive.

By now, most of use who are lucky enough to have a Pat have most likely broken the engine in. For those with a Trail Rated Patriot has your Gas milage improved since it's been broken in? What kind of MPG are you getting?

AZRayne... check your PMs... :D

I have a manual 4wd sport. I am in the foot hills of the NC mountains, have 3600 miles and average around 24 to 25.

My Sport FDII is averaging 21 - 21.5 on the first 1000 miles in mixed hwy city. HIghway max speeds are 70-75. Obviously we are learning on how to be smooth with the CVT, which is a big adjustment. Also I have ordered a K&N air filter to see if that gets another .5 - 1 mpg.

Can anyone with a trail rated Pat give me an idea of how many miles per TANK they've been getting?

I have a FDII with off-road crawl ratio/trail-rated Patriot.

I actually really like this vehicle but think that the fuel tank size is the main limitation for me. I do moderate off-roading for work (biologist). We get into some remote areas far from gas stations.

I have put on about 10000 km in the last month and a half (6250 miles) and have had reasonably good fuel economy if driven without A/C and under 3000 rpm on highway. Over 3000 rpm, the fuel economy drops precipitously. A/C also sucks up its fair share.

I could do just as well with my 98 Jeep Cherokee Sport 4 L engine (it would get better gas mileage at higher highway speeds relative to the Patriot--the Patriot will do well if you stick to the double nickle but not if you do 75-80 mph). My Jeep Cherokee had a 75 l (approx. 20) US gal) with another 10 l in the filler neck (2.5 US gal). I could go 800 km (500 miles) on a tank and regularly did. Not off-roading or with A/C of course -- I would feel totally comfortable under almost any conditions doing 650 km (400 miles) on a tank with the Cherokee.

The Patriot has a 51 l tank (13.5 US gal) and I can get about 7 l (almost 2 US gal) in filler neck.

With the Patriot FDII, I have driven as much as 338 miles (540 km) on one tank but typically do much worse. I would say I am totally comfortable with 250 miles (400 km) on a tank under virtually any condition--moderate off-roading, stiff head winds, A/C . . .

Some of the places I go are 100 miles one way from gas station. That doesn't leave much room for error and I don't like carrying extra fuel in external containers (smell, safety etc.). I must now really limit my speed, watch when I am in AWD, keep off the A/C on some trips.

I knew this would be a problem before I bought the vehicle but I like the overall package (and still do--it has had a good workout in the last month and a half). I continue to hope for some after market fuel tank. Even 10 l (2.5 US gal) extra would be a reasonable safety net for me. Don't know why I can't get a 65-70 l tank as standard though!

Another data point...

I have the CVT2L/FDII and just took my first long trip (1500 mi on the odo). Averaged 25.3 MPG. Generally flat, with A/C on about 50% of the time. Stuck to around 65 MPH.

Just another bizarre piece of info--the fuel tank on the 2WD is .1 gal larger than the 4WD. One would think 4WD should suck more fuel, need a bigger tank (BIGGER than 0.1 gal, but bigger nonetheless).

The best thing to do is use that sites fuel purchase option. After about 10 fillups, you will get a true average of MPG instead of a "I got 25mpg this tank". The more tanks you track...the more accurate the figures.

Jeep always points out the 30 MPG highway for the Patriot but fail to mention that is the 2WD 5-Speed Small 4 banger.

Jeep always points out the 30 MPG highway for the Patriot but fail to mention that is the 2WD 5-Speed Small 4 banger.

I don't believe you can get a 5 speed with the small (2.0 litre) 4 banger.

Kanus - You are right, they don't offer the 2.0 engine with 5 Speed. Thats probably too bad because it would probably get really good economy with that combo!

I have a Sport 4X4 5 speed. Only have 1500 miles on it. So far I am gett between 24 and 27 MPG. I do live in Colorado (high altitude) and have a heavy foot most of the time.

How about getting the gas right from the source.....

http://www.planet.eon.net/~homac/homemadegas.jpg

Okay, another mileage check-in. My Pat has 4200 miles on it now. Just gave it it's first oil change before this trip and put in Mobil1 synthetic 5w-20 as recommended.

Trip was 514 miles round-trip, with A/C on 70% of the time. Speed was average 70mph. Climbed from Tucson (2000 feet) to Flagstaff (7200 feet) and back down.

MPG: 27.6 (high was 28.2).

FWD with CVT

AZ - Thats a good test of the Patriot, that long incline towards Flagstaff

I bet you didn't use much fuel on the way down!

The mpg numbers are great, especially if you didn't use Cruise control..

AZ - Thats a good test of the Patriot, that long incline towards Flagstaff

I bet you didn't use much fuel on the way down!

The mpg numbers are great, especially if you didn't use Cruise control..

I would have used cruise if it were available! That is actually one option I"m thinking of getting. Yes, it's good mileage overall. On the crawl up toward flag, the mileage dropped to about 23.5mpg but as you mentioned... it balanced itself out on the return trip.

Forgot to mention... about 150 miles with a bike on my roof yakima rack. Had to put the bike inside second half of the trip up and all of the trip down because of thunderstorms...

AZ - Thats a good test of the Patriot, that long incline towards Flagstaff

I bet you didn't use much fuel on the way down!

The mpg numbers are great, especially if you didn't use Cruise control..
Coming down the mountain from Lake Arrowhead near San Bernadino, the EVIC reported gas mileage of 76mpg. :D
Unfortunately it is a twisty/windy road so I couldn't whip out my cell phone to take a pic.

I think, when stating your mileage it would be helpful if you could include what type of transmission you have and if the car has the off road package or not. The axle ratios are different based on the package. OK folks, you've broken in your cars by now, how are you doing???:)

I think, when stating your mileage it would be helpful if you could include what type of transmission you have and if the car has the off road package or not. The axle ratios are different based on the package. OK folks, you've broken in your cars by now, how are you doing???:)
I've made that request a few times already. I suggested putting the relevant information as part of our signature so that it is readily available.

That's a good idea!

I posted the most recent government fuel economy figures below:

Natural Resources Canada Office of Energy Efficiency

Jeep Patriot 2WD 2.0 L, Automatic
9.0 L/100km (26.1 MPG) City
7.3 L/100km (32.2 MPG) Hwy

Jeep Patriot 2WD 2.4 L, Manual
9.0 L/100km (26.1 MPG) City
7.2 L/100km (32.7 MPG) Hwy

Jeep Patriot 2WD 2.4 L, Automatic
9.7 L/100km (24.3 MPG) City
8.0 L/100km (29.4 MPG) Hwy

Jeep Patriot 4WD 2.4 L, Manual
9.3 L/100km (25.3 MPG) City
7.4 L/100km (31.8 MPG) Hwy

Jeep Patriot 4WD 2.4 L, Automatic
9.9 L/100km (23.8 MPG) City
8.2 L/100km (28.7 MPG) Hwy


US Environment Protection Agency

Jeep Patriot 2WD 2 L, Automatic (CVT FDI)
10.23 L/100km (23 MPG) City
8.71 L/100km (27 MPG) Hwy

Jeep Patriot 2WD 2.4 L, Automatic (CVT FDI)
11.20 L/100km (21 MPG) City
9.41 L/100km (25 MPG) Hwy

Jeep Patriot 4WD 2.4 L, Manual
10.69 L/100km (22 MPG) City
8.71 L/100km (27 MPG) Hwy

Jeep Patriot 4WD 2.4 L, Automatic (CVT FDI)
11.76 L/100km (20 MPG) City
9.80 L/100km (24 MPG) Hwy

Jeep Patriot 4WD 2.4 L, Automatic (CVT FDII)
12.38 L/100km (19 MPG) City
11.20 L/100km (21 MPG) Hwy

Thanks homac, much appreciated!

Thanks homac, much appreciated!

No problem. These are a rough guide, however after reading several posts you can really impact fuel consumption by changing the factors below:


Driving habits
Terrain
Air Conditioning
Cargo
Tire pressure
Oil type/grade
Petrol type/grade


I used to run my Plymouth Neon tire pressure close to 40 PSI (just under the safe limit) and I noticed a measurable decrease in fuel consumption. The ride was a bit bumpy though! ;)

No problem. These are a rough guide, however after reading several posts you can really impact fuel consumption by changing the factors below:



Air Conditioning





There was a recent radio car show that did a fuel consumption comparison on using/not using air conditioning and I believe their conclusion was that it was a negligible difference between the two in cars built recently.

Another data point for me: 21 MPG toting kids around-town driving in hot weather, A/C on constantly. 2700 miles on the odo now - I think it's broken-in enough now. 2 weeks ago I got 27 MPG on mostly highway 50-55 MPH, so it appears to vary widely. I've been using the EVIC MPG numbers.

You should be able to drive between 515 km and 708 km based on the government figures. (320 to 440 Miles)

The manual transmission and 2WD would be towards the high side, the CVT and 4x4 would fall in the lower range.

You should be able to drive between 515 km and 708 km based on the government figures. (320 to 440 Miles)

The manual transmission and 2WD would be towards the high side, the CVT and 4x4 would fall in the lower range.

I doubt you'll ever get near to the Canadian Government figures.

Guys and gals, this thread has been just great. It really has helped me see what is going on. I realize that whatever model Patriot I get, high speed driving will reduce mileage because the car has a square front and the wind resistance can hurt. Toss in A/C running and the effect is worsened. My driving will be through villages or on country roads 90 % of the time running 30-55 mph. Rarely would I be using the expressway where speeds are averaging 70 mph. On the other side of the coin, I live in a weather intensive area, snow in winter, Nor Easters or Hurricanes possible in the late summer to fall with heavy flooding, winter gales and hot dusty summers. I think I'm going to go for the trail rated version, and it ain't for the badge. I just think I want all the extra protection that package can give me. Thanks to all of you who took the time to give us info on how you did mileage wise.

I'm going to sit down with my dealer next week to order my car. I am going to try and see if I can get the off road package combined with the autostick transmission. (JEEP! Are you listening???) I'll let you all know how things go with my Patriot.:smiley_thumbs_up:

Sounds good - you're making an informed decision and thats what matters.

Apparently the aerodynamics count for a lot. I was talking to one of the Jeep Engineers (at camp jeep) about the Patriot fuel economy, and the engineer said that the extra 1" ride height is a major reason that the FDII had lower economy than the FDI, because of the somewhat poorer drag coefficient.

That is very interesting! I can understand that. My wife is hammering on me about the off road package, "You don't need it, you're not going to be climbing trails out east, etc." Frankly she does have a point, so if I can't get the off road package and the autostick, I'll just get the autostick, I really think I will be using that.(If I DO get the off road package, it may be the first trail rated Patriot WITHOUT the badge!) heh,heh.

Hey all,

Here's a tip that I wasn't privy to until just recently -- if you have the average MPG meter on your Patriot (it comes with the package that includes the tire pressure readings, etc.), that average is a continuously running average, meaning it takes into account ALL driving (highway and city). Translation: the average will appear to go down over time as the stop and go city driving will bring it down. With that in mind, I just took a 130 mile trip where I reset the MPG meter and drove between 65 - 75 mph on the highway through some hilly countryside (I-90 in the Berkshire mountains in MA). At the end of the trip, my final average reading was 27 mph (it appeared I was averaging mostly 26-something the whole trip). That's pretty good in my book and I am a big fan.

So reset your MPG meter on your next long trip . . .

I have been re-setting the MPG meter frequently to test different conditions and habits. My 5 speed manual, FD1, with 17" off road tires at 60 MPH on level pavement consistently gets 30.3 MPG. I have about 1,400 miles on my Patriot.

My wife is hammering on me about the off road package, "You don't need it, you're not going to be climbing trails out east, etc." Frankly she does have a point, so if I can't get the off road package and the autostick, I'll just get the autostick, I really think I will be using that.(If I DO get the off road package, it may be the first trail rated Patriot WITHOUT the badge!) heh,heh.

Holy Crapoly. I know what you are feeling Johnda. My wife was feeling the same way. "Its not like we have mountains here" "Its not like you are going to be offroading everyday". Well two weeks ago, the rain was so bad that it started flooding. I was able to take a detour (with her in the vehicle) to get home from a flooded street. Needless to say it was a bad detour, full of mud, and water up the wazoo everywhere. I quick engaged Low Gear snapped the 4x4 lever and got through almost 15-25 " of water, mud and who knows what else. The water level was up almost 3 - 4" past the lower door seal. No water came into the cabin, the Jeep kept on rolling like nothing. My wife has not complained about it at all. Now she is looking to get a Patriot for herself, identical to mine, except white in color.

I have about 3700 miles on my 4x4 Off-Road package and am getting about exactly the EPA estimates: averaging about 22.2, about 70/30 highway/city driving. Last tank was mostly highway, got 23.3 mpg.

But that's mostly taking it easy. Was running late for an appt once and had to hightail it, mostly in bad traffic and stop signs right after I fueled up and reset the calculator, and it read 18.0 when I got there.

Cool! I thought about that fording ability, since we're in hurricane territory, but finally gave in and ordered an 08 with autostick. I'm thinking the same thing...If my wife falls in love with it, she could trade in the Camry for one for herself, We'll just have to see how things work out. My red sport is due to arrive in four to six weeks. Drool, drool!

Have been keeping accurate stats of my fills and km. FD II trail rated version.

Total km 13044 (=8105 statute miles)
Total litres 1427.4 (=314 Imperial gal or 377.1 US gal)
(I fill each fill to top of filler neck--not that it should matter averaged over this distance but I do it as a matter of course).

This is about 80% highway driving at 60-75 mph (100-120 km/h), 10% city driving with very little stop and go (ie. mostly freeway, or local roads with no lights, minimal traffic), and 10% off road using 4WD in hi and lo range. Air conditioning has been on perhaps 5% of the time (remember if you want better mileage above freezing temperatures, and if you can for your environment, keep the controls off of any defrost or defrost/heat combo setting otherwise the air con compressor will be running and dehumidifying the interior and consuming more fuel unnecessarily)

All of this equates to:
10.9 litres/100 km (rated at 8.2 l/100 km in Canada, 11.2 l/100 km in USA highway)
25.3 miles/Imperial gal (rated at 28.7 mpg in Canada highway)
21.1 miles/US gal (rated at 21 mpg in USA highway)

range was 10.6-12.3 litres/100 km = 22.9-26.6 miles/Imp Gal = 19.1-22.1 miles/US gal

Looks like US Environment Protection Agency is more correct for my driving habits.

My largest fill so far has been 54.1 liters -= 11.9 Imperial gal or 14.3 US gal (it only has a 51 liter tank)
and my greatest range has been 546 km (=339 miles)

(remember if you want better mileage above freezing temperatures, and if you can for your environment, keep the controls off of any defrost or defrost/heat combo setting otherwise the air con compressor will be running and dehumidifying the interior and consuming more fuel unnecessarily)


Are you sure the AC is on whenever the controls are set to defrost?

You mentioned that this is the case above freezing temperatures. Does the AC not operate when the controls are on defrost when the temperature is below freezing?

Are you sure the AC is on whenever the controls are set to defrost?


According to the manual, the AC kicks on anytime you choose a fan selector setting that is pointing to the windshield. In both mix (defrost/floor) and defrost setting. Regardless of whether you have the AC button pressed or not.
Page 225

So... yes... :)


Jim

The A/C has always been linked to the defrost with few exceptions. It's the A/C that dries out a humid interior, whether cold or warm.

For those who take stock in a radio show called Cartalk, they have taken a few questions about A/C and mileage in recent years and according to their 'research' there is not a whole lot of mileage difference in newer cars between having it on or off. Here is one example:

http://www.cartalk.com/content/columns/Archive/1994/May/05.html

I have heard this elsewhere as well but cannot put my finger on it right now.

I have heard this elsewhere as well but cannot put my finger on it right now.

:) Mythbusters (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MythBusters_(season_3)#AC_vs._Windows_Down)

(notice the clever link within the link back to CarTalk) ;)

That's where it was - thanks!

It still seems to be an insignificant difference. I will not feel guilty about running the A/C when it's hot out or when my windows are fogging up.

Air Conditioning can use significant amounts of fuel.

Here is one test result paper conclusions:

http://www.nrel.gov/docs/fy00osti/28960.pdf

"Vehicle air-conditioning can significantly impact fuel economy and tailpipe emissions of conventional and hybrid electric vehicles (HEV) and reduce electric vehicle (EV) range. In addition, a new U. S. emissions procedure, called the Supplemental Federal Test Procedure (SFTP), has provided the motivation for reducing the size of vehicle air-conditioning systems in the United States. The SFTP will measure tailpipe emissions with the air-conditioning system operating. Current air-conditioning systems can reduce the fuel economy of high fuel-economy vehicles by about 50% and reduce the fuel economy of today’s mid-sized vehicles by more than 20% while increasing NOx by nearly 80% and CO by 70%."

As far as I know North American cars seem to have this link to the air compressor on defrost type settings. My Japanese cars have been unlinked. I would prefer a button that would say "dehumidify" rather than assuming dehumidification is needed for all defrost settings. While it certainly does clear windows faster, it is not always required.

Looks like the more fuel efficient cars and hybrids particularly get a big hit on fuel economy from running air con. Keeping windows open is also a drag and is a big hit on fuel economy. If you need air con on, obviously you need it on but I find I really don't need it at temperatures (in dry humidity areas) below 30 degrees C (86 F) but I love the heat!

A lot of the information on the internet is so vague as to be not useful. If you have specific test data, like the paper above, I would be interested. I know air conditioning is not "insignificant".

See if I can't find some real world examples for vehicles like Patriot . . .

Note that some of the previous posts were just about fuel economy with windows down compared with air con on. They didn't talk about the absolute energy draw of the air conditioning compressor when operating. The differences between having air con on and windows rolled down may be insignificant but that does not mean that use of air conditioning has an insignificant impact on fuel economy. If it did, it wouldn't have been rolled into the new EPA ratings methodology . . .

Look at http://www.nrel.gov/vehiclesandfuels/ancillary_loads/pdfs/fuel_savings_ac.pdf
Slide 16 for a comparison of air conditioning MPG to non-air con MPG

Fuel economy drop is 10-18% with AC on, 4% with defrost on.

Figures for hybrids (difference with air con on and off) are dramatic!

http://www.hybridcars.com/gas-mileage-factors/airconditioning.html

"The hybrids we tested got 15 to 27 percent lower fuel economy with the air conditioning on," said Jim Francfort, principal investigator at the Idaho National Laboratory in Idaho Falls, which is operated for the Department of Energy.

As I said earlier, if you need air conditioning on, you have to use it but if you can avoid using it (and the compressor for defrost modes!), you will save some bucks--enough to buy some cool beers perhaps

see also figure 3 on Chevron's site:

http://www.chevron.com/products/prodserv/fuels/bulletin/fuel_economy/

They note that use of defroster can be as significant as air con in some vehicles under some conditions. I presume this is the linked dehumidifying in the defrost modes on North American vehicles. In my Jeep Cherokee, it stated that this function (compressor running on defrost modes) only operated above freezing. Below freezing, the compressor did not run. I presume the same is true on the Patriot but it hasn't been cold enough to check this out. You will notice the engine running slightly more roughly when the compressor is on. That has always been my cue to switch to non-defrost modes when I really didn't need it.

In another series of tests "operation of the vehicle AC system caused substantial decreases in vehicle fuel economy, ranging from 2.5 to 4.5 miles/gallon."

http://shorterlink.com/?PMSK87

and the windows up vs down debate has some real information at:

http://www.sae.org/events/aars/presentations/2004-hill.pdf

Seems that both Air Con AND Windows Down are significant drags on fuel economy but Windows Down still uses less fuel than Air Con on . . .

and last ( I hope) but not least, EPAs own stats:

" b. Air Conditioning. To assess the impact of air conditioning on fuel economy, we compared the fuel economy measured over the SC03 test to a comparable portion of the FTP. The SC03 test is run with the air-conditioning turned onto its maximum setting in a test cell set at 95 [deg]F with strong sun load and moderate humidity. On average, air conditioner operation at 95 [deg]F reduced fuel economy by about 21 percent. The impact of air conditioning ranged from -41 percent to -25 percent for more than a third of the vehicles. Similar to the cold temperature impacts, there was a great deal of vehicle-to-vehicle variation in the impact of air conditioning on fuel economy . . . the vast majority of vehicles show an impact of -27.5 percent to -7.5 percent. Hybrid vehicles tended to show greater sensitivity to air conditioning operation than conventional vehicles. The effect of air conditioning operation reduced hybrid fuel economy by 31 percent, 50 percent greater than the 20 percent impact on conventional vehicle fuel economy."

http://www.epa.gov/fedrgstr/EPA-AIR/2006/February/Day-01/a451.htm

Greetings everyone! I just wanted to let everyone know that I have an 07 Sport 5 spd manual 2.4 liter 4X4 FDI and my first tank gave me 29 miles to the gallon. I left the dealership with a full tank. Always ran the A/C (humid in Missouri). And when I reached 346 miles on the odometer (26 prior to delivery) I was able to only add 11.034 gallons of 87 octane unleaded. That is correct 320 miles divided by 11.034 gallons = 29.001 mpg. My daily commute is roughly 80 miles hwy and 22 city. The state of Missouri is pretty flat like Kansas which contributes to my decent fuel economy.

Look at http://www.nrel.gov/vehiclesandfuels/ancillary_loads/pdfs/fuel_savings_ac.pdf
Slide 16 for a comparison of air conditioning MPG to non-air con MPG

Fuel economy drop is 10-18% with AC on, 4% with defrost on.

Is this the same group of people who have been telling us about our expected mileage all these years and now have been forced to finally correct themselves?

;);)

They note that use of defroster can be as significant as air con in some vehicles under some conditions.

Shouldn't it be exactly the same? Wouldn't the compressor be either on or off?

I think the cooling compression is different than dehumidifying compression. I am no expert -- not sure how the electronics work but suspect that there is a lower energy requirement for defrost. There is no cooling with the dehumidifying (defrost) only so that leads me to believe less energy consumption, hence less fuel used.

Took my Patriot 4x4 Off-Road version out to the desert Saturday and instead of doing better on gas on the highway it did worse - averaged 20.0 mpg compared to my normal 22.5 or so.

Could be several reasons for this. The road was gradually hilly, going from roughly sea level at San Diego to a high of 4000 feet and back down again. I was also doing 70-75 mph much of the way. I think that the Pat's chopped off back and upright windshield probably equal a pretty poor coefficient of drag, so it is probably more susceptible to high speed loss of efficiency.

The poor mileage could be related to the TSB for the CVT transmission. I recently had my CVT's firmware updated and I noticed that the engine was at 1000 rpm less on the highway when traveling at 65 mph.

Before the TSB update my Patriot would cruise at 65 mph and the engine read about 3000 rpm. After the update on the same stretch of highway the tach read about 2000 rpm.

It would seem that at certain RPM / load ranges the CVT wasn't getting to it's final drive ratio. This would make the mileage worse on the highway because the enginer is reving more to maintain the same speed.

Just a thought. Note, not all Patriots need the TSB update. You will have to have the dealer check it with the CAN Bus diag tool to verify the firm ware version the CVT is using.

~Mike R~

The poor mileage could be related to the TSB for the CVT transmission. I recently had my CVT's firmware updated and I noticed that the engine was at 1000 rpm less on the highway when traveling at 65 mph.

Before the TSB update my Patriot would cruise at 65 mph and the engine read about 3000 rpm. After the update on the same stretch of highway the tach read about 2000 rpm.

~Mike R~


I figured 3K was the norm for the 4 banger
my neon was rev at 3K at about 65,
so figured the 4 cyl pat was revving at about the same,

my CVT is at ~2100 RPM at 65mph, 2.4L 4x2 2008

Fuel economy is becoming troublesome for me. I am not pleased. :mad:

When I first picked up the Patriot, I was getting 22 city and 27 highway.

I have been monitoring closely the past days (sitting in the 3000 km or 1800 mile range) and my EVIC reports 20.2 city and 20.5 highway. :(

Not good. Not sure if there is a problem or not. If this continues, I will be very disappointed since selecting the 4 cylinder was solely for the fuel economy.

I have no idea if the TSB software update has been performed or not. Is there any outboard way to tell - like a sticker or label somewhere? :confused:

I will complain when I take my Pat in for its first oil change.

I answered early on in this thread and now have over 10k miles on my Patriot from driving to work 40 miles one way. My fuel mileage has basically settled into a 25-27 mpg range and usually 26 plus for the driving I do. I have also fallen back into my normal driving patterns for cruising speed and stop-and-go driving; which means faster for both. When I got my Patriot, I was very careful to drive under 65 mph and to feather the pedal from lights. Partly because it was new, and partly to prove to myself it could get the advertised fuel mileage. My Patriot was built before the newer software date and I will eventually have that updated. I have been waiting to see if I have any other issues first before I make a special trip.

Edit: All of this has been in Florida with the A/C on 95% of the time.

Edit 17 Sep 2007: I realised I have not checked my tyre pressure since I purchased my Patriot back a few months, and thought to do that last night. They all were 30-31 psi on the Goodyear Wranglers. That may be intentional from the dealer to make it ride better, so I bumped that up to 40 psi. Since my gas mileage has been staying steady at around 26 mpg, I will see if it does better with the pressure pumped up.

2.4 litre, CVT FWD Sport

I've got 1000 miles now, and my 4x4 CVT is getting 22-23 mpg average. On my daily trek on the 65mph highway, I get 25-26. Too bad I couldn't drive through town at 65mph without any stops...

That is acceptable mileage, I really would be satisfied with that myself. I'll find out when I get it.

After my first tankful I'm getting 21.7mpg. That is assuming that the dealer actually filled the tank to the brim as I did when I refilled. This was with the A/C or the defroster on constantly. It's either been hot here, or raining pretty much constantly for my driving on that whole tank. Now that it's cooled a bit, it's A/C off and windows down. That along with my Auto-Stick experimentations (see the '08 auto-stick thread) I'm hoping to see an increase.

I noticed I am revving at 3K at 100 kmh (62.5mph). I suppose the computer is keeping the revs *up* so that torque is available. I'd rather have the overdrive effect and knock the revs back when the software senses I am cruising rather than accelerating. My EVIC reports an average of 20.7.

I noticed I am revving at 3K at 100 kmh (62.5mph). I suppose the computer is keeping the revs *up* so that torque is available. I'd rather have the overdrive effect and knock the revs back when the software senses I am cruising rather than accelerating. My EVIC reports an average of 20.7.

Sounds to me like you might need that TSB service performed ( http://www.jeeppatriot.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2178 ) -- mine is a little over 2K rpm at that speed.

I noticed I am revving at 3K at 100 kmh (62.5mph). I suppose the computer is keeping the revs *up* so that torque is available. I'd rather have the overdrive effect and knock the revs back when the software senses I am cruising rather than accelerating. My EVIC reports an average of 20.7.

That's because you have FDII and it's normal. The final drive ratio is different on that drive system and accounts for the higher engine rotational speed.

http://www.jeeppatriot.com/forum/showpost.php?p=6034&postcount=24

Thanks for the replies.

I will keep monitoring and query the services guys as to what version of software the Pat is running. I had been running a 27mpg average the first 3 days of getting the car but I immediately had it out on a vacation excursion so there was 90% highway driving and lots of it under 60mph.

1st tank 26.7 MPG
2nd tank 28.2 MPG
NM driving with AC on MAX
2wheel stick
Very pleased !!!!!!

As of September 2nd, I am averaging 19.8mpg - this with a mix of 60% city and 40% highway. My highways speeds are 65 - 70mph. My mpg worsens with each passing day.

Quasi - ~20mpg with 60% City driving on an automatic is not bad.

I don't know too many 3400lb automatic vehicles that can get 20MPG with that much city driving.

as of yesterday, my average reported by the EVIC is 19.8
:(

thanks for the confidence booster, hunter

I want to try the software change -- or could it hurt even more?

Mine is new and I've filled up twice so far .... 25 mpg each time ....
automatic CVT Sport. I don't know if the TSB is up to date ... built 5/07.

I have been keeping a log. Here is what I have after 4 fill-ups and 997 miles.

Total U.S. gallons: 29.67
Miles: 997
Average MPG: 33.6

2008 Sport 4x4, 5spd Manual. Good mix of city (stop lights, stop and go, 25-35mph), rural (County Trunks 45-60mph) and freeway/interstate (65-70mph) driving, all about 1/3 of total.

Quite impressed considering it's responsiveness, but then to be honest I have a history for doing better than the EPA estimates.

91 Ram 250 manual 4spd EPA rating 12mpg hwy. My overall average 15.3mpg.
95 Lebaron GTC Conv. 4spd Auto. EPA rating 29mpg hwy. My overall average 29.5mpg

Talked to my dealer today, they do not want to adjust anything for at least 10,000 kms. They said the computer is still learning about my driving habits so they STRONGLY recommend not flashing the software for about 6 months. Grrrr.

I have to ask, you have a 2007 that (I think) you got in May of 2007. Since that time a TSB went out about updating the software on the early 07 Patriots. Did you get that update done to the software, or is this what they are saying they don't want to do. If this is the update that the TSB calld for and they don't want to do it, I think something is wrong here. Folks, any comments here?

If there is a TSB which is related to a vehicle of a certain build date then what does it have to do with the mileage? Sounds like they are trying to dodge the work.

Talked to my dealer today, they do not want to adjust anything for at least 10,000 kms. They said the computer is still learning about my driving habits so they STRONGLY recommend not flashing the software for about 6 months. Grrrr.

Just to add quasimodem, you can input your vin number at the link below and it tells you of any TSB's applicable to your vehicle. Maybe this will tell you if your Patriot needs the software update or not.

http://www.jeep.com/en/owners/

Enter VIN on left hand side under recalls.

Hi folks:

Patriot Kmc: Yes, I did check-in my VIN and it said no updates were pending.

johnda: It is a 2007. I have no idea if the TSB was performed or not. I noticed in the TSB that there is a mod label available.

Does anyone know where the mod label would be attached had the update occurred? The service guy just blew me off at the desk. Perhaps the task is not billable to Chrysler and the dealer has to eat the labour.

I have been on vacation this past week (running errands and stuff), so this week is about 80% city driving. I am at 19.3 average right now. The EVIC just shows a steady decline is all since picking the Patriot up on July 24.

Does anyone know how average is calculated by the EVIC? I am going to have to keep a running log as others have done and reported here I think. If the EVIC algorithm computes ALL gas consumed against the total number of hours (the elapsed time shown on the EVIC), then I will have to abandon the the EVIC count and go with my own log. If the EVIC only records, say the last 5 or 10 operating hours, then I have a better shot at getting a more *current* average. Ideally, I am hoping the EVIC resets on each tank fill up - once it registers a + value to the tank for example. Example: if I expended a whole tank in the city, I should be able to determine an on average city reading. I could then take a tankful raod trip by highway to get some approximation of highway mpg.

Thoughts?

Is it possible for you to try another dealership? Maybe you'd have better luck this time.

I'm not sure the recalls page on the Jeep site shows all the TSBs that might apply to your particular vin# or just the safety recall ones.

In any case, when I took my Patriot in for it's oil change I mentioned that the check engine light had been on for a day or so but now it wasn't ( I think my gas cap had been loose), and I had a copy of that TSB with me and said I wondered if that might help.

Well they checed it out, couldn't find anything wrong, but applied the TSB anyway just to make sure. It really didn't cost them much time to do it since the were changeing the oil and doing the other service checks anyway. They didn't even charge me any extra over the oil change. No hassle.

Just remember, some dealerships are run by jerks, and some are not.

JeepFan:

You are right. I have not got a lemon Patriot but I may have a lemon dealer - at least the service folks. It was my first time dealing with them. Hell, the buying experience was no hell for that matter.

I will go the JeepFan route at a dealer near where I work. I will just tell them about the engine light and the gas mileage and "oh by the way, would this TSB eliminate the problem?" [chortle].

Thanks, JeepFan

Patriot Kmc: Oh yea, gotta find a different dealer to do the service I think.

Hi folks:



I have been on vacation this past week (running errands and stuff), so this week is about 80% city driving. I am at 19.3 average right now. The EVIC just shows a steady decline is all since picking the Patriot up on July 24.

Does anyone know how average is calculated by the EVIC? I am going to have to keep a running log as others have done and reported here I think. If the EVIC algorithm computes ALL gas consumed against the total number of hours (the elapsed time shown on the EVIC), then I will have to abandon the the EVIC count and go with my own log. If the EVIC only records, say the last 5 or 10 operating hours, then I have a better shot at getting a more *current* average. Ideally, I am hoping the EVIC resets on each tank fill up - once it registers a + value to the tank for example. Example: if I expended a whole tank in the city, I should be able to determine an on average city reading. I could then take a tankful raod trip by highway to get some approximation of highway mpg.

Thoughts?


The EVIC calculates the amount of fuel passing through the fuel system against the miles logged on the odometer. Elapsed time has nothing to do with it.

The EVIC rests the calculation each time you press reset on the EVIC's MPG screen. If you don't reset it at each fill up, then you will capture a larger fuel consumption sample over greater distance traveled.

Thanks for that insight, InfernoPatriot.

I just came off of some extensive highway driving (95% hwy vs 5% city) and the overall average has improved greatly. This using the overall mpg average because the EVIC has never been reset.

Average now is 24 mpg over all for about 70 hours of operation.

Another evic-calculated data point for my FDII Patriot (while on a long drive from MD to NC):

- Approx 24.3 MPG (ran 1/2 tank @ ~55 MPH, no A/C)
- Approx 23.5 MPG (ran 1/2 tank @ ~60 MPH, no A/C)
- Approx 22.5 MPG (ran 1/2 tank @ ~60 MPH, with A/C)



Oh yeah.... all the while I was towing 1000 lbs (motorcycle on a flatbed trailer)

I've been getting nearly 25mpg (~11.3L/100km) now that I'm driving on the highway more often. I've driven it for probably roughly 30hrs.

Another mileage update. Strange thing is that I'm getting better mileage in town than on the highway. I guess it's not so strange since my "city" driving really isn't too much stop/go. Long stretches between lights and steady cruising at 35-45mph. Morning commute: 12 miles, usually no A/C. Evening commute: 12 miles, A/C.

The verdict: City 26.1mpg

On the highway, I'm still getting about 26mpg as well. This is steady cruising at about 70-75mph with the A/C running.

This is without the new computer "flash" needed. 2007 Sport 4x2 with CVT

I rarely get more than 21 mpg on my FDII 2007 Patriot. The sticker claims an EPA rating of 21 city and 23 highway and that is fairly close to what you can get if you don't mash the throttle to much.

I added a custom Magnaflow exhaust and that has not made any difference in mileage, but sure improved the performance, sound and looks.

Hey man I want to see pics of this exhaust job! Would love to hear the sound of it if possible!!

I rarely get more than 21 mpg on my FDII 2007 Patriot. The sticker claims an EPA rating of 21 city and 23 highway and that is fairly close to what you can get if you don't mash the throttle to much.

I added a custom Magnaflow exhaust and that has not made any difference in mileage, but sure improved the performance, sound and looks.

Yes! Pics and sound bro. :smiley_thumbs_up:

My '07 4x2 5-spd gets 27mpg, religiously, with mixed and/or highway driving.

Looks like I have to settle for 20 - 22 MPG. I have the heavier configuration with CVT2L, FDII. So this means I have to account for the skid plates and severe-service components which probably weigh more as well. Also final drive ratio is higher than most other configurations leaving me revving at about 2900 rpm at about 65 mph. My Pat loves cruising at 50-55 mph. Highway driving at that sustained speed gets me 27 MPG. It doesn't like city driving much 19 MPG maybe.

"What car did you drive before getting the Jeep Patriot?"

"I used to drive a Corvette Stingray."

"Oh really. Did you have the 6-speed or the automatic?"

"It was a 3 speed."

"A 3 speed? They don't make a 3 speed Corvette Stingray."

"Well, my Vette was a 3 speed - Fast, Faster and Dearly beloved we are gathered here!"

:doh:

My overall average has been 28.8 mpg at 2000 miles. I drive 60% city and the rest is rural highway with very little interstate driving. I do not drive mine in an attempt to get fuel economy, in fact, I would say spirited driving would be accurate. The last tank was 27.9 and that included one run to 100+ mph. The manual transmission just kills the cvt for economy in real world driving.

Well my last tank i got 26.67 mpg had 335.8 miles and used 12.588 gallons of gas. I am very impressed as my avalanche only gets 11.3 mpg so this is a huge imporvemnt nice to doa fill up for less than 100 bucks... Love the patriot very much.

I've been getting 28.8 MPG for ALL city driving, and 34.2 for mostly highway. I DO attempt to get the best MPG's as possible. I've added a fuel Fogger and I mix 2 ounces of Acetone with every 10 gallons of gas, and I've added another fuel filter after the stock fuel filter, for extra protection. Check there sire out, very interesting.

http://www.brightgreen.us/

If you can check out there products page, that's where you'll find more info on the fuel fogger and the concept behind it. In the mean time, keep that PAT truckin.

2007 4x4 Sport E Pkg.
5 Speed with nice tires and rims

Looks like I can pull my gripe from the board. I appear to be settling in at 19 city and 22 hwy. Considering I have the weightier Limited with the Trail Rated stuff and the published MPG for my configuration is 21 and 23, I am pretty much on the money since the posted amounts are based on ideal conditions. I guess now I am just suffering from gas mileage envy when I see the scores you 4X2 drivers are pulling in.

I get 30-32 highway, 25-27 City. 4X4 with K&N and a Gibson Exhaust. Manual of course, I had to put that because I know some of you would ask.

I currently get 25 city MPGs with my Cav' and am really excited about the comparable mileage with the Riot.

Sidebar: MyDadoo just got a biga$$ van that gets, drumroll please, 13 MPGs... ha!!!

This is from another thread in the forum, and if you can't tell I'm battling with this guy to prove that I do get better MPG's, I'm posting it here because I have photos of the fogger.

My engine is making more use of the fuel it get's and it's proven in the MPG's. My best MPG was 31 and all highway, my best in town was 26.3. With the fogger I've gained 3-4 more MPG's on both Hwy and City. I know my tank didn't increase in size, the fuel wasn't super rated, and I used the same station and pump every time. The results speak for themselves, no matter how many numbers you crunch, or how hard you try to disprove it, my Pat got better mileage with this device that has no moving parts, it just sits there and sends super heated fuel into the injectors and allows the engine to burn a more clean burn and use less fuel to achieve the same desired outcome.

I've noticed I don't have to press the pedal down as much to achieve the desired speed on acceleration. If that's not proof enough, then I don't know what is.

I took a picture of the fogger on the Pat. Check it out.



The size of the fuel fogger is the same size of the interior diameter of the radiator hose. I believe it's 1 1/2 in. approx. The upper radiator hose is where it goes, for that is where the hot water/coolant exits the engine.

If that photo doesn't load above, go to the site I have them on.

http://www.valmoritz.com/fogger.html

Looks like I can pull my gripe from the board. I appear to be settling in at 19 city and 22 hwy. Considering I have the weightier Limited with the Trail Rated stuff and the published MPG for my configuration is 21 and 23, I am pretty much on the money since the posted amounts are based on ideal conditions. I guess now I am just suffering from gas mileage envy when I see the scores you 4X2 drivers are pulling in.

I a doing 20 - 21 mpg, combined city/highway. I have over 2,000 miles and I cant seem to get it to go more. I drive with air/without, some stop and go traffic and highway. I know what I was expecting, but me just like you all that are trying to squeeze some more juice out of it can find a way. Maybe the fogger would be a good idea.

I am not sure about the fogger. Not that I am disclaiming its results in any way, it's just that I have leased my Patriot (my first time ever leasing a vehicle). I worry about violating lease terms and conditions is all -- if there are any.

jeephigh, send this one to mythbusters. I would love to see it on their show. I bet they would try it, they have done everything else it seems.

I hear ya Quasimodem, and I wouldn't have put it on my rig if I didn't make sure that it wasn't going to void my warranty in anyway possible. I talked to one of the guys at Britghtgreen and he even put it in writing that a car company cannot void my warranty if I put a fogger on unless I or the person who put it on "me" caused damage to a warranted part and they can prove it 100% that I caused the problem, then I'm in trouble, because this thing was quite easy to put on.

I'm still trying to figure out the best possible "tune" for it, because I'm not getting what I want for MPG on the Hwy, I should be in the 36-37 range, but I've noticed with my ScanGaugue that the Pat only runs at 176-180 degrees while traveling on the Hwy at 60-70 MPH, I need her to run hotter and/or change out my thermostat to keep that hot coolant in the engine a hair longer so as to get that fuel heated to that magic 196 degree mark.

The car runs quieter and smoother on the road, this was the first major thing I noticed the first time I ran it with the fogger on. If you guys are interested in getting one, let me know, but you might as well wait until I get it tuned just right so you guys don't have to mess with it. Check out the brightgreen web site, they state in there that this product can't void a warranty. I'm not sure about a leased vehicle though, sorry.

http://www.brightgreen.us/

jeephigh, send this one to mythbusters. I would love to see it on their show. I bet they would try it, they have done everything else it seems.

I'll do it, that's the best idea that anyone has had on the forum, a public T.V. showing proving it's use, how do I submit the idea to them?

This is from another thread in the forum, and if you can't tell I'm battling with this guy to prove that I do get better MPG's, I'm posting it here because I have photos of the fogger.

My engine is making more use of the fuel it get's and it's proven in the MPG's. My best MPG was 31 and all highway, my best in town was 26.3. With the fogger I've gained 3-4 more MPG's on both Hwy and City. I know my tank didn't increase in size, the fuel wasn't super rated, and I used the same station and pump every time. The results speak for themselves, no matter how many numbers you crunch, or how hard you try to disprove it, my Pat got better mileage with this device that has no moving parts, it just sits there and sends super heated fuel into the injectors and allows the engine to burn a more clean burn and use less fuel to achieve the same desired outcome.

I've noticed I don't have to press the pedal down as much to achieve the desired speed on acceleration. If that's not proof enough, then I don't know what is.

I took a picture of the fogger on the Pat. Check it out.

The size of the fuel fogger is the same size of the interior diameter of the radiator hose. I believe it's 1 1/2 in. approx. The upper radiator hose is where it goes, for that is where the hot water/coolant exits the engine.

If that photo doesn't load above, go to the site I have them on.

http://www.valmoritz.com/fogger.html

It seemed more appropriate to continue this discussion in this thread.

You may be seeing an improvement, but I don't think it's for the reasons the inventor/vendor states.

Have you verified your fuel efficiency by recording the amount of fuel you put in the tank and the distance on the odometer? I assume that you have done this, but I still must ask the question. This method is not inaccurate; just inconveinient. You do this over 5-10 tankfulls to get a better average.

Assuming that the computer and your direct observations are close enough of a match, there are a few more explainations for your observations.

The increased fuel temperature has increased its pressure. Based on an 80 degree F temperature rise and a thermal expansion coefficient of .0006/degree F, this gives a 5% expansion. With the fuel system sealed, this raises the fuel pressure. The ECU monitors fuel pressure and shortens the pulse signal to the fuel injectors, therefore less fuel gets into the engine. Less fuel injected yields increased economy at the sacrifice of a slight (but measurable) power loss. A non-fuel injected vehicle would not gain any benefit.

The increased fuel temperature has had an effect on engine ignition timing. Specifically, the heated fuel has cause the ECU to retard timing a few degrees, again, increasing economy at the sacrifice of a slight power loss.

As to the "I don't have to press the pedal down as much" comment, that's a very subjective observation and not easily measureable or reproducible. It could a placebo effect -- the only way to really tell would be a chassis dyno before and after.

I'm not sure what effect your acetone addition has on your fuel economy. I'd have my doubts about that too, but that's another discussion.

I do commend you for being a good driver and getting such good fuel efficiency 26.3/31. At what speed was your highway mileage recorded?

I'll do it, that's the best idea that anyone has had on the forum, a public T.V. showing proving it's use, how do I submit the idea to them?

You can submit ideas from the following page:

http://dsc.discovery.com/fansites/mythbusters/mythbusters.html

You may want to see Mythbusters Episode 53: Exploding Trousers, Great Gas Conspiracy where they test acetone as a fuel additive.

They're usually pretty good with their experiment setups and conclusions.

I would like to correct my third post up from this one, my prior MPG's were 26.3/31, once the fogger was put on I'm continually getting 29.1/34.9 for city/hwy. I may not have conveyed that post as well as I had hoped, I think I was on the phone at the same time. My highway speeds are usually about 65 MPH sometimes I drive on rural mountain highways and dive 55 MPH for a good hour or so with mountain's terrain. I don't usually use A/C unless I'm in the city.

The fogger must do something, as my fuel economy has improved by about 4 MPG's, not the 7-10 I was told, but we're getting there. The car does feel smoother running then it did before, but I do notice that when I'm sitting in traffic and the temp on my ScanGauge reads 200 degrees for my coolant, the PAT noticeably moves quicker off the line with less pressure applied to the pedal, and most defiantly feels "smoother". Why, I have a few thoughts, but it must having something to do with hot fuel hitting those injectors and/or when that combustion occurs.

Whatever it is, I like it, I feel it, and it's saving me a few bucks every time I fill up that beast of a tank :) yeah right. I'm trying to find where the thermostat is on the PAT so a to change it out to a 190 or 200 degree stat and keep that coolant warmer longer. if anyone knows where it is that would help greatly.

On a side note, does anyone know where or how to buy the optional tow hooks that the trail rated jeeps have. I just looked at the mounting points on the PAT and it doesn't seem all that hard to put them on yourself, a few bolts and your there..... that is after you've removed the front end bumper and cut a hole in it.

And thanks for the Props's Brett on saving fuel, I know it probably does decrese power a bit, but for me, I didn't buy the PAT for 172 HP rally racer. I also removed the air silencer/intake mount that runs off of the air box to allow hotter air into the engine, now I might put it back on to see if there's a difference or not in power.

I'm not saying I don't believe you... but, hmm...

Did you change oil from synth blend to fully synthetic?

How many miles have you been running this device? Any possibility you are seeing your Patriot break in?

How about driving habits? Did they possibly change as you became more interested in MPG?

When did you get your Scangauge? Before or after the fogger device? My MPGs went up substantially after acquiring the SG.

Is this a one tank, two tank, or multiple tank average? Are your MPG calculations done via pen and paper or by the Scangauge (mine isn't real accurate).'



By the by, although the fogger might not void your warranty, you are going to have a tough time explaining acetone in your fuel system... :(

I didn't change my oil at all, I should but not to fully synthetic. I going to be using oil from the Torko Oil Company, http://www.torcoracingoils.com/ best oil on the planet, that's why it's not in your local auto parts store, and it's a bit more expensive. I was just like you Mitak, very skeptical of this whole thing, but it does work, and I think I know why it doesn't work as well as it's suppose to. Any how, I calculate my MPG's with both the SG and pen and paper. I use the same station and pump every time I check the mileage. I had the fogger on for 2k miles and I currently have 8k miles on the PAT. Driving habits didn't change a bit, from the day I got into that Jeep I was going to try and get the best possible MPG I could, that's the mail reason I got it beside the 4x4 capability.

I got the SG before I put the fogger on, and did notice a change the first time I started the car, better MPG, etc. Although, I think my O2 sensor may have something to do with the let down I'm having with my current MPG. As I read peoples experience with this device, I'm noticing that people aren't getting out of it what they had expected until they add something called a FeverBuster in between the O2 sensor and the vehicles computer. I guess with the fogger on the car, the exhaust make up doesn't have as much burned fuel in it as oppose to a normal burn without the fogger and the O2 sensor tells the computer to richen the FTA (fuel-to-air) mixture to make up for the loss, when in fact it's not a loss it a cleaner burn and thus the car uses more of that fuel I'm trying to save instead of being happy with burning cleaner. This will be the last step in my better MPG adventure, and if in fact this doesn't get me my desired results, I'm going to have to be happy with just good enough, but 34-35 highway mileage isn't that bad for a 4x4 5spd. Jeep.

im slightly dissapointed in the gas mileage on my 5spd 4x4, i get about 22-23 around town and like 26-27 on the hwy, the sticker said 25 and 29 and i figured i could do a little better than that.

i got the patriot to have a car that got good mileage so i dont always have to drive my denali around. overall im happy with it but there are a few things im not stoked on

Hey Entrust, how many miles do you have? Your mileage will IMPROVE after the break-in period of roughly 4000 Miles.

You should definitely see improvement, just be patient!

I just got 24.5mpg off the last tank, and I was trying to conserve fuel. I would say that the miles I drive consists of roughly 30% city and 70% highway. I have about 1200 miles on the Pat now, so it will improve, and I'll be happy with just an all round 25mpg without driving like a granny. It's the aerodynamics of the body and a little bit higher gear ratio the stops the Pat from doing better. It seems the designers didn't want people to feel that it was a dog in overdrive, so that what I think is why the gear ratios are higher. Mine does fine on the freeway as far as power, I have to watch my speed or I'll find myself going 80mph all the time.

i got about 2500 miles on it so far, i guess i need to wait a little bit longer :)

07 Patriot white/tan 2.0L 4x2 auto Sport w/K&N filter insert

4200 miles now. 75-80% highway driving, 60-70mph, 400-500 miles a week

Getting a solid 26mpg overall. :smiley_thumbs_up:

have a CRD Ltd 2l 6 speed manual

have just clocked 600 km on the 1st tank of diesel

getting 7.7l per 100k so 640k per tank should get closer to 700k after a few more fills

sorry have no idea about miles per gallon as no idea what a US gallon is

Thats 31mpg equivalent on the diesel. Which i gotta say is pretty dissapointing. Especially considering some people are getting 28mpg with their 5spd gas.

It's his first tank though isn't it?

He also didn't mention the type of driving he's been doing on his CRD. It could have been all CITY or hills..

Maybe he's visiting Pittsburgh:-)

Went 200 miles to Las Cruces NM yesterday . Left before 6am/temp
was 58deg F...was brim full....slowly speed up to freeway speeds
No red lights /No idling /No driving over 3000 RPM/AC OFF /windows
all up/filled up to the brim just like I did before leaving
was expecting 30-35 MPG!!!!ONLY GOT 27.9 MPG!!!!
5 Speed/1400 miles on the clock/On the way back with AC on
&daughter driving 75MPH + =32.21 MPG(I do not understand!!!!!!!)

Strong tail wind? :p LOL

Or the elevation could have been slightly different (more down-hill on the way back?). The only way to know for sure is to do it again!

Don't you just love trying to figure out the world of MPG, there are so many variables that one couldn't even begin to explain. Do the trip again but maybe on that second leg try the 65 MPH instead of the 75 MPH and you should see even more of a MPG boost............ maybe:doh:

He also didn't mention the type of driving he's been doing on his CRD. It could have been all CITY or hills..

yes was first tank

400k city driving peak hour 20k in about 40 min - start stop

rest was semi rural - 60k of 100km

most hilly

expect that to improve by at least 20% down to about 6.5 to 7 l per 100k

used to get 17to 18l per 100k in the grand cherokee v8 4.7 l doing the same stuff

was expecting 30-35 MPG!!!!ONLY GOT 27.9 MPG!!!!
5 Speed/1400 miles on the clock/On the way back with AC on
&daughter driving 75MPH + =32.21 MPG(I do not understand!!!!!!!)

Never saw 35 mpg in my neon,
lucky when i got 30 mpg, on +300 mile highway trips
neon averaged 25 mpg
My FDII Pat is currently maxing at 23 mpg on +300 mile highway trips
and averaging 21 mpg combined during the week
past month have spent $396 on gas.

My Patriot just rolled 3000 miles. This last tank of gas was 80% highway driving (72 mph). I averaged 30.3 mpg. Manual trans rocks!

I am getting at worst mix driving 23.5 MPG, 26 pure highway. Better than the new ratings.
This is on an '07 CVT 4x4.

I got 26.25 mpg on my last tank. About 90 miles of the 315 were city, the rest highway.

(2007 4x4 manual trans)

I only have 600 miles on my Pat, I just got back from a 300 mile round trip, which was 270 miles highway, 30 city. I had the cruise control at 70 and my scangauge says 21.8MPG but a simple trip odometer and gallons measurement at the pump after a fillup read 22.4MPG...

I expect the mileage to get better as the motor gets broken in.
I have a '08 CVT Autostick

just back from holiday house in donegal. 140 miles. 40 on motorway at 75mph rest on a and bumpy b roads in donegal.
43.8mpg.....

you guys need diesel.......

but remember fuel prices. Donegal is much cheaper that UK. filled up at 1.05 euro per litre..in UK it is around 95p per litre!!!!!!

I am getting at worst mix driving 23.5 MPG, 26 pure highway. Better than the new ratings.
This is on an '07 CVT 4x4.

400+ miles on my 08, 4x4, CVT my very worst mileage is 23 MPG and it is stop and go traffic with a high acceleration at the end of my lane to enter the main road where folks come ripping by doing 55-60. On a long cruising run averaging between 55 and 65 MPH, I was getting close to 27 MPG average.

So it looks like we're getting very close to the same mileage, and I am quite happy with that. I am also happy with the "punch" the car has. It seems to rush along very smoothly, and has power when you need it.
:smiley_thumbs_up:

Talked to my dealer today, they do not want to adjust anything for at least 10,000 kms. They said the computer is still learning about my driving habits so they STRONGLY recommend not flashing the software for about 6 months.
My recommendation would be to get the flash done now since the revised programming has been released as part of a TSB. Assuming the new code has been thoroughly tested and certified by engineering, why wait six months for the flash because whatever the onboard computer is now learning about your driving habits will be lost when the flash is completed and the ECU/ECS/EMS control unit is reset.

Since your local dealer has refused to perform the service, contact your region's Jeep factory representative or contact Jeep directly and inform them of your dealership's refusal to comply with the TSB request. That done, I'm willing to bet that the service department at your dealership will experience an attitude adjustment and change of heart as regards the TSB.

Irish Waif ;)

750 miles or 1200kilometers on my 08 Patriot Limited 4x4 CVT2 2.4L.

First full tank was about 22.4MPG or 10.5l/100km, second/third tank 26.2MPG or 9l/100km.. and on the freeway that computer is telling me values now that sound even better.. (my Cherokee 4.0L got 17MPG if lucky).

A thing I've noticed now that the CVT has started acting a whole lot better as I get some miles on it. A LOT more power when I get moving and it accelerates a lot faster than it used to in the start. My wife loves it, smooth shifting, no hickups and it simply works the way it should.

Ran a tank without A/C (suffered through the heat). Mileage went up from 21mpg to 25mpg. 2.4L, 4x4, 5sp
Since I live in Texas, looks like I'll have to live with poorer mileage. Maybe the A/C will get more efficient with time as the compressor wears?