homac
03-14-2010, 12:27 AM
There are so many water leak threads out there I finally decided to create a post addressing the common causes and solutions for the knowledge base.
Sunroof (Courtesy Roberttroll)
Sunroofs should not leak. The holes are to drain away "incidental" water. Meaning morning dew on your roof blown inside. Water should not be getting past the outer seal. You can test your sunroof alignment using a piece of paper.
"The sliding glass panel is designed to seal water entry with a snug fit between the roof and the seal. The fit can be checked by inserting a piece of paper between the roof and the seal. The piece of paper should have some resistance when pulled out when the glass panel is in the closed position. The sunroof housing will drain off a minimum amount of water. Excessive wind noise could result if the gap clearances are exceeded. The sunroof glass panel may need to be adjusted." (This would be completed by your dealer or by refer to Sunroof Glass Panel Adjustment in the Service Manual should you have one)
An easy way to rule out a sunroof leak is to run a bead of silicone around the edge of the sunroof. If it stops leaking then it is the seal. If I were out of options i would run a light bead of silicone on the inside edge, thereby creating a tighter roof/gasket seal.
Roof Rail Holes & Roof Welds
Refer to the leak detection guide. (see bottom of post)
Should this be the issue you will have water coming from your dome light(s). You may also see water in the foot wells as it would be running down the A pillars and side beams.
Moisture in the area behind the driver or passenger seatbelt coil (beside the door) also indicates water leaking from the roof.
This is easily repaired by completely removing the headliner AND completely removing the roof rack. Ask your dealer to show you your Patriot once these two items are removed. If they cannot, or will not go elsewhere. If they say they did and you did not see it, it did not happen.
When these items are removed the area surrounding the roof rack holes can be cleaned. Silicone can be placed around the holes and assembly and the rack can be put back on and screwed together.
On the top of the roof you will see to long strips of black plastic stripping. That covers the roof line welds. They can be completely removed. Silicone sealant can be applied and the strips put back on. Surprisingly there is no need to re-weld anything as a good quality natural silicone will last forever and also ensure you can take these strips back off if you ever need to do so.
In almost all cases after a leak the headliner will have to be replaced due to the risk of mold. If water has made it down to the floor boards / foot wells the carpeting will have to be removed and replaced due to the risk of mold. Have your dealer show you the old headliner and/or old carpeting. If they cannot, or will not they were not replaced.
You can pry off the scuff plate at the base of the door and pull back your carpeting. Slide your hand under the carpeting checking for moisture. If it is there the carpeting must be removed and the area made completely dry.
Water/Moisture in Footwell Only
This is likely a firewall or wiring harness gromet leak. To verify, it is important to check the A pillars (columns between the windshield and doors) for moisture. If you have no moisture there or coming from your dome light this is likely the cause. You can put a finger up and around the dome lights again checking for moisture.
No water or moisture in the roof area, however water on the floor board indicates a firewall, gromet or door weatherstripping failure. You can access these gromets by opening your driver door and looking into the fender area. You will see a large rubber gromet. Ensure it has not fallen out of place. Other gromets and holes through the firewall are accessable via the engine compartment.
In most cases you will require some dealer involvement to fix that issue, however because they do not own the Patriot themselves and likely do not care, it is best to tell them what to do and where to check. (sad but true)
Rear Tailgate/Liftgate Leak
Refer to the leak detection guide. (see bottom of post)
This is likely the easiest leak to diagnose and repair yourself. In fact I recommend doing this fix even if you do not have a leak !
Water is found in the spare tire area.
You will see two areas where water can pool leading to a leak. Between the two liftgate hinges right in the top centre of the door frame you will see a plastic button (painted the same color as the rest of your Patriot). This plastic button can leak around the edges. Clean around the button with rubbing alcohol. Using a high quality silicone sealant seal around the button.
You will see a tube supplying window washer fluid to the rear window. Using the same procedure above seal around the hose and gromet to body panel using silicone.
The weather stripping surrounding the door frame should also be checked and pressed into place. This rubber weather stripping is usually stuck onto the frame using a soft black tar substance. It works well, however if not applied correctly as the factory water can sneak past. You may request your dealer to completely remove the rear hatch weather stripping, re-apply the goo, then re-install a new weather stripping. The old weather stripping cannot be used unless you want leaks and black tar all over your interior in a couple days.
Click here: Leak Detection Guide (http://www.telusplanet.net/~homac/Jeep%20Patriot%20Leak%20Detection.pdf)
What next?
So either you or your dealer have completed all the items above, but you still leak. Now what?
Document each visit to your dealer.
Retain the invoices for each visit to your dealer, this invoice should detail the work completed.
Ensure your dealer shows you what they completed.
After two unsucessful attempts by the dealer, contact Chrysler and have them open a file. Request they contact the dealer.
If the dealer says the Lemon Law does not apply or there is nothing you can do, DO NOT BELIEVE THEM.
After three unsuccessful repair attempts, especially on a new Patriot it is Lemon Law time. Complete the paperwork/process detailed below:
Canada:
Canadian Motor Vehicle Arbitration Plan (CAMVAP) (http://www.camvap.ca)
United States:
Free Lemon Law Guide by State (http://www.free-lemon-law-guide.com/state-lemon-laws.php)
Consumer Affairs (http://www.consumeraffairs.com/lemon_law/)
Lemon Law Basics (http://www.lemonlawbasics.com/)
Yes, you will have to do some reading and yes it may take you a couple months but you will win. It is a huge pain to follow the process, but sometimes life is like that. You will also get a new Patriot or receive the purchse price back. There is no sense posting complaints about leak issues unless you have followed the process above.
.
Sunroof (Courtesy Roberttroll)
Sunroofs should not leak. The holes are to drain away "incidental" water. Meaning morning dew on your roof blown inside. Water should not be getting past the outer seal. You can test your sunroof alignment using a piece of paper.
"The sliding glass panel is designed to seal water entry with a snug fit between the roof and the seal. The fit can be checked by inserting a piece of paper between the roof and the seal. The piece of paper should have some resistance when pulled out when the glass panel is in the closed position. The sunroof housing will drain off a minimum amount of water. Excessive wind noise could result if the gap clearances are exceeded. The sunroof glass panel may need to be adjusted." (This would be completed by your dealer or by refer to Sunroof Glass Panel Adjustment in the Service Manual should you have one)
An easy way to rule out a sunroof leak is to run a bead of silicone around the edge of the sunroof. If it stops leaking then it is the seal. If I were out of options i would run a light bead of silicone on the inside edge, thereby creating a tighter roof/gasket seal.
Roof Rail Holes & Roof Welds
Refer to the leak detection guide. (see bottom of post)
Should this be the issue you will have water coming from your dome light(s). You may also see water in the foot wells as it would be running down the A pillars and side beams.
Moisture in the area behind the driver or passenger seatbelt coil (beside the door) also indicates water leaking from the roof.
This is easily repaired by completely removing the headliner AND completely removing the roof rack. Ask your dealer to show you your Patriot once these two items are removed. If they cannot, or will not go elsewhere. If they say they did and you did not see it, it did not happen.
When these items are removed the area surrounding the roof rack holes can be cleaned. Silicone can be placed around the holes and assembly and the rack can be put back on and screwed together.
On the top of the roof you will see to long strips of black plastic stripping. That covers the roof line welds. They can be completely removed. Silicone sealant can be applied and the strips put back on. Surprisingly there is no need to re-weld anything as a good quality natural silicone will last forever and also ensure you can take these strips back off if you ever need to do so.
In almost all cases after a leak the headliner will have to be replaced due to the risk of mold. If water has made it down to the floor boards / foot wells the carpeting will have to be removed and replaced due to the risk of mold. Have your dealer show you the old headliner and/or old carpeting. If they cannot, or will not they were not replaced.
You can pry off the scuff plate at the base of the door and pull back your carpeting. Slide your hand under the carpeting checking for moisture. If it is there the carpeting must be removed and the area made completely dry.
Water/Moisture in Footwell Only
This is likely a firewall or wiring harness gromet leak. To verify, it is important to check the A pillars (columns between the windshield and doors) for moisture. If you have no moisture there or coming from your dome light this is likely the cause. You can put a finger up and around the dome lights again checking for moisture.
No water or moisture in the roof area, however water on the floor board indicates a firewall, gromet or door weatherstripping failure. You can access these gromets by opening your driver door and looking into the fender area. You will see a large rubber gromet. Ensure it has not fallen out of place. Other gromets and holes through the firewall are accessable via the engine compartment.
In most cases you will require some dealer involvement to fix that issue, however because they do not own the Patriot themselves and likely do not care, it is best to tell them what to do and where to check. (sad but true)
Rear Tailgate/Liftgate Leak
Refer to the leak detection guide. (see bottom of post)
This is likely the easiest leak to diagnose and repair yourself. In fact I recommend doing this fix even if you do not have a leak !
Water is found in the spare tire area.
You will see two areas where water can pool leading to a leak. Between the two liftgate hinges right in the top centre of the door frame you will see a plastic button (painted the same color as the rest of your Patriot). This plastic button can leak around the edges. Clean around the button with rubbing alcohol. Using a high quality silicone sealant seal around the button.
You will see a tube supplying window washer fluid to the rear window. Using the same procedure above seal around the hose and gromet to body panel using silicone.
The weather stripping surrounding the door frame should also be checked and pressed into place. This rubber weather stripping is usually stuck onto the frame using a soft black tar substance. It works well, however if not applied correctly as the factory water can sneak past. You may request your dealer to completely remove the rear hatch weather stripping, re-apply the goo, then re-install a new weather stripping. The old weather stripping cannot be used unless you want leaks and black tar all over your interior in a couple days.
Click here: Leak Detection Guide (http://www.telusplanet.net/~homac/Jeep%20Patriot%20Leak%20Detection.pdf)
What next?
So either you or your dealer have completed all the items above, but you still leak. Now what?
Document each visit to your dealer.
Retain the invoices for each visit to your dealer, this invoice should detail the work completed.
Ensure your dealer shows you what they completed.
After two unsucessful attempts by the dealer, contact Chrysler and have them open a file. Request they contact the dealer.
If the dealer says the Lemon Law does not apply or there is nothing you can do, DO NOT BELIEVE THEM.
After three unsuccessful repair attempts, especially on a new Patriot it is Lemon Law time. Complete the paperwork/process detailed below:
Canada:
Canadian Motor Vehicle Arbitration Plan (CAMVAP) (http://www.camvap.ca)
United States:
Free Lemon Law Guide by State (http://www.free-lemon-law-guide.com/state-lemon-laws.php)
Consumer Affairs (http://www.consumeraffairs.com/lemon_law/)
Lemon Law Basics (http://www.lemonlawbasics.com/)
Yes, you will have to do some reading and yes it may take you a couple months but you will win. It is a huge pain to follow the process, but sometimes life is like that. You will also get a new Patriot or receive the purchse price back. There is no sense posting complaints about leak issues unless you have followed the process above.
.